Question:
First, I — and from the feedback I’ve gotten from these messages, others — find Chomsky’s perspective both insightful and interesting, even when they disagree. It seems that you and a very few others are unable to tolerate it, finding it unbearable. I strongly doubt that Chomsky would waste his time discussing NATO here, especially with the caliber of discussion exemplified by you.
Chomsky is interesting even though I disagree with most everything he says. If only he could learn to be consistent (and do better fact checking), he would live up to his hype. Brian Carnell http://www.carnell.com/ ICQ # 2000890
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How true! Anyone who has not even heard of Chomsky cannot call him/herself well read. The reason so many people are so frightened by Chomsky’s message is that they have been so indoctrinated by the mass media, that they wouldn’t know any original thinkers if they walked up to them in the street and stabbed them.
Who is "frightened" by Chomsky? Disappointed in his lack of research and dogmatic adherence to falsified positions, but fearful? Incidentally, Chonsky is not a Marxist. Again, the amazing amount of indoctrination people are fed by the mass media renders them incapable of underswtanding that merely because he believes in putting power in the hands of athe people, he is not necessarilly a Marxist.
The problem is that Chomsky seems to be the only member of the New Left refugees who isn’t an unreconstructed Marxist. David Barsamian, who has published many interviews with Chomsky, seems to be as does the whole host of Z magazine contributors and associated writers. Read Michael Parenti’s books sometime. He is closer to an anarchist, though I know that most of the people reading this are so stupid that they don’t even know what this is.
He says he is an anarchist, but ask him sometime what he envisions replacing the current system. IT DOES NOT MEAN THAT HE FAVORS POLITICAL CHAOS AND BOMB THROWING !!! Being a Rousseauian he believes rather that the innate goodness of human beings is corrupted by our political, social, and economic institutions. He beileves in a radical decentering of power, which would make him the antithesis of a Marxist.
Does Chomsky believe there will be no need for a coercive state? Where do you find this in his writings? Brian Carnell http://www.carnell.com/ ICQ # 2000890
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How true! Anyone who has not even heard of Chomsky cannot call him/herself well read. The reason so many people are so frightened by Chomsky’s message is that they have been so indoctrinated by the mass media, that they wouldn’t know any original thinkers if they walked up to them in the street and stabbed them.
Good lord, I wouldn’t wan’t to imply that there might be any Dissent in the Chomsky Communist Camp, but I’ve got to disagree with this statement. I don’t think Chomsky is particularly original. I think he’s on the ball, but I don’t think he’s come up with anything particularly _original_. The one thing that Chomsky really has going for him is that he’s good at collecting information and he has a very empirical view of the world and doesn’t go for the usual b.s. Marxist revolutionary propaganda. He’s got a very conservative style of anarchism/individualism which allows him to present his evidence clearly and draw clear conclusions from it when he can. I don’t think, however, that his conclusions are particularly radical in that they’ve never been presented anywhere before. — Lamont Granquist (lamontg at u dot washington dot edu) -note spamfilter<- "First consider a spherical chicken…" ICBM: 47 39′23"N 122 18′19"W unsolicited commercial e-mail-contacting your ISP to remove your net.access
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – (snipped a lot of bullshit) Noam Chomsky replied: (snipped even more bullshit) Can anybody tell me, who this idiot is? If Lars J
Question:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I agree with you except that there is a time for sex and that is after marriage. Sex before marriage can take the time that could have been used in knowing your partner better. You might be more inclined towards your partner in a physical sense as a result. Falling in love with your partner for what she is instead of what how she looks like is what’s going to keep your marriage together. I agree that even before marriage, you can experience such a love that you can justify the intimacy of sex. Yet, sex should be reserved for the person who is going to be with you forever. You should not have sex for a ‘high’ or a good time. Your body worths more than the moment. Sex before marriage also has psychological consequences. Makes you feel cheap. Resentment builds up when you have come so close with someone in a relationship as to have sex and it breaks up. It also has consequences after you get married (too long of a list to mention). If you have had many sex partners, sometimes you will experience flashbacks once married and would keep comparing your previous sex partners with your wife. This can cause a lot of trauma to you and to your wife. There is a lot about this subject. All my opinion, no flaming please. DJ George, I’m not saying it’s a thing to do to experience a ‘high’ – but it dosn’t make you feel cheap…(it leaves many people feeling loved) Everyone will feel their own way about it – I think you would feel cheap, as those are your words – I would simply feel that the relationship was never meant to be (I’ve never had sex with anyone who I didn’t think I would be with for less than half my life – but people do change over time, the person my mother married is, "not the same man!" – this is why people get divorced; after 20 years (typical example of a friends parents) they no longer had anything in common so they went their seperate ways – no hard feelings – no regrets – circumstances change), I look back on my previous girlfriends with affection, but it’s the past and you move on. You can’t live in the past. You can look to the past to see your mistakes – and make sure you don’t repeat them – but not everyone sees the same things as mistakes, as this thread proves. I think you also misunderstood my reasons for falling in love, for me looks are just the first impression (unless someone is so ugly you can’t look at the them, they could be the one for you): I find I have weak spot for people with a personality that makes them very sure of their direction in life and their opinions. Goth girls with attitude a definite plus! Someone I can talk to for hours upon end – a conversation that never stops is essential if your going to be with someone for the rest of your life – so intelligence is part of this. I’ve never had a flashback – your right that would be scary, so if you can’t cope with it, don’t do it – but I’ve heard so many stories about people getting names wrong! As I said, Catherine has had 3 previous partners and this dosn’t bother me – if she calls me Vim (unlikely after so long), then it simply shows that she feels/felt the same way about both of us – I know she loved him and therefore I shouldn’t be ofended
Enough. This is a music N.G. I have my values and you have your values. Let’s go back to the groove. DJ George, – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – James
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While I agree that drink and drugs have no place at raves, I don’t understand why you would want to avoid having sex. The way I see it skrewing is the ultimate dance. Especially if you do it to dance music
I disagree. I think that dance is the ultimate screw. I’ve included an excerpt from a review written about a particularly orgiastic tekno party which I participated in recently. This is in response to DJ George’s comments which, to me, suggest the limitations which we like to place on ourselves and which we’re so concerned about placing on others. kath *Eris told me to do this* [Part of a longer] BEYOND THE BRAIN Review Saturday 22 February 1997 Byron Bay Australia By APpLesEed, BigK, Felis, Jane, Mitch, Nigel, Paleslaive . . . The main room which featured twisted, dark and hard trance (dubbed by silly conversations during the night as the "pure sick room") involved the marauding mayhem of local sound wizards Mandy and Nick Taylor, and Tsuyoshi Suzuki from Japan. The music was thoroughly infectious, and the energy in this room was beyond belief – a lot of whoops, yells and growls emanated from this underworld – and it was packed right up until the last note struck its searing spark. This sacred space was painted entirely black and had a 22 pointed star on the floor – the 22 paths of the Tree of Life, perhaps. It seems that whoever was behind this was a Qabalist. The ceiling was covered in "spider webs" and a cross of white material was hanging over the star on to which a series of symbols were projected, and which also captured the stark lighting. This at first consisted purely of white light beams upon a black background. At the beginning of the event, it was pretty dark-ambient/laid back and this amazing lighting clearly distinguishable. The atmosphere and energies in this room were unlike any we have experienced before. We are keen travellers to many forest gatherings where the atmosphere can get very magickal and very "darkly" weird at times, but this room was incredibly orgiastic in intent it seems. The energies bubbled like an erupting volcano as the nonstop mayhem of belting beats rang out their relentless toll. The room was packed like a slaughterhouse with flailing limbs and animalistic utterances. The temperature was glowing hot and people were not only dancing with each other but slipping around on each other. Tickling stimulation all over. It’s surprising that no one ended up naked. We were writhing and dripping back into the primeval ooze, covered in spider webs as well 
, conjuring the energies of Azathoth as we dissolved into the void. Mad! It felt, too, like an alien corroboree, maybe there was a vigorous didgeridoo in the mix somewhere . . . Mitch could imagine this as the latest in a sequence of dance events that preceded the white settlement of Byron Bay, stretching back into the dreamtime . . . Nick Taylor’s set was a standout with sounds that were somewhere between hardcore and goa where the flouro pink has faded into a somewhat nastier shade. Some of Nick Taylor’s signatures were evident – such as the use of a guitar-like distorted-chord sound that drives the tracks along. Tsuyoshi Suzuki’s set also lent toward the hardcore realm with booming hardcore 150 bpm sounds and rapid analog swells building through the noise. Excellent stuff. — Kathleen Williamson The University of Queensland Brisbane Q 4072 Australia Disclaimer: Opinions expressed are mine and not those of the university
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – I agree with you except that there is a time for sex and that is after marriage. Sex before marriage can take the time that could have been used in knowing your partner better. You might be more inclined towards your partner in a physical sense as a result. Falling in love with your partner for what she is instead of what how she looks like is what’s going to keep your marriage together. I agree that even before marriage, you can experience such a love that you can justify the intimacy of sex. Yet, sex should be reserved for the person who is going to be with you forever. You should not have sex for a ‘high’ or a good time. Your body worths more than the moment. Sex before marriage also has psychological consequences. Makes you feel cheap. Resentment builds up when you have come so close with someone in a relationship as to have sex and it breaks up. It also has consequences after you get married (too long of a list to mention). If you have had many sex partners, sometimes you will experience flashbacks once married and would keep comparing your previous sex partners with your wife. This can cause a lot of trauma to you and to your wife. There is a lot about this subject. All my opinion, no flaming please. DJ George,
I’m not saying it’s a thing to do to experience a ‘high’ – but it dosn’t make you feel cheap…(it leaves many people feeling loved) Everyone will feel their own way about it – I think you would feel cheap, as those are your words – I would simply feel that the relationship was never meant to be (I’ve never had sex with anyone who I didn’t think I would be with for less than half my life – but people do change over time, the person my mother married is, "not the same man!" – this is why people get divorced; after 20 years (typical example of a friends parents) they no longer had anything in common so they went their seperate ways – no hard feelings – no regrets – circumstances change), I look back on my previous girlfriends with affection, but it’s the past and you move on. You can’t live in the past. You can look to the past to see your mistakes – and make sure you don’t repeat them – but not everyone sees the same things as mistakes, as this thread proves. I think you also misunderstood my reasons for falling in love, for me looks are just the first impression (unless someone is so ugly you can’t look at the them, they could be the one for you): I find I have weak spot for people with a personality that makes them very sure of their direction in life and their opinions. Goth girls with attitude a definite plus! Someone I can talk to for hours upon end – a conversation that never stops is essential if your going to be with someone for the rest of your life – so intelligence is part of this. I’ve never had a flashback – your right that would be scary, so if you can’t cope with it, don’t do it – but I’ve heard so many stories about people getting names wrong! As I said, Catherine has had 3 previous partners and this dosn’t bother me – if she calls me Vim (unlikely after so long), then it simply shows that she feels/felt the same way about both of us – I know she loved him and therefore I shouldn’t be ofended James
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – While I agree that drink and drugs have no place at raves, I don’t understand why you would want to avoid having sex. The way I see it skrewing is the ultimate dance. Especially if you do it to dance music and can keep it up for as long as you would dance at a rave — Christian Ellegaard Do What Thou Wilt Shall be the Whole of the Law I agree… I don’t drink or smoke – and wouldn’t even consider it. It could be that different places (around the world and even different parts of each town) have different attitudes, but I cannot see the problem of having sex with someone who you are in a long term relationship with. I’m extremely impressed so many of you have held on to your virginity – I also feel that I have made the right decisions in my life (2 previous partners + current girlfriend (fiance)): Let’s not kid ourselves – making love to someone is a combination of our strongest feelings for that person, a very pleasurable physical experience and finally (least of all since our brains were able to cope with so many emotions) our method of procreation. – It’s enjoyable, non addictive (well maybe;
Question:
positive event. With the amount of publicity they are currently receiving, Zack is now using the bands hype to promote action and social activism on some very important issues. Read up on the EZLN rebellion in Southern Mexico, The Leonard Pelltier Defense comitee, and the Family and Friends of Mumia Abu-Jamal, and then you’ll understand why R.A.T.M’s fame is so helpful.
At their concert in Utah, 8,000 people showed up, and we had a booktable with various information, from the EZLN to Leonard Peltier, Mumia, Food Not Bombs, and Autonomy House Collective (our soon-to-be infoshop). While it was a bit disheartening to see how little many of the people knew (countless people came to our table wearing the RATM "we support our troops" Zapatista t-shirts and asked us was our big "EZLN" sign meant), but many were wanting to know more, and we have been getting a bunch of calls from people wanting to help out. Most were surprised to hear there were any anarchists in Utah… Unfortunately, we didn’t have the forsight to have a pro-zapatista march in Salt Lake City the next weekend, because we could have had over 1000 show up as opposed to our usual 50-100. Greg — Visit the Utah Anarchism and Revolution Page at: http://www.cs.utah.edu/~galt/revolt.html
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At their concert in Utah, 8,000 people showed up, and we had a booktable with various information, from the EZLN to Leonard Peltier, Mumia, Food Not Bombs, and Autonomy House Collective (our soon-to-be infoshop). While it was a bit disheartening to see how little many of the people knew (countless people came to our table wearing the RATM "we support our troops" Zapatista t-shirts and asked us was our big "EZLN" sign meant), but many were wanting to know more, and we have been getting a bunch of calls from people wanting to help out. Most were surprised to hear there were any anarchists in Utah…
That is pretty disheartening! You probably heard about RATM’s appearance at the Tibetan Freedom Concert in San Francisco this summer? Well, I was holding a big EZLN sign during their performance, and when Zack saw it, he paused to say a few words about another "Vietnam in southern Mexico." You may have seen the exact quote in Rolling Stone (I think it was in the August issue). As he was saying those very words, some total ignorant asshole came from behind me and took the sign, tearing it up in the process. I guess I was blocking his view, but I tried to explain that Zack was at that very moment talking about the EZLN. To no avail, I suppose. Anyhow, I thought the incident was a bit ironic. Has anyone heard what’s up in Chiapas lately? About a week ago Marcos sent out a letter to the NCDM saying that the Mexican army was launching a surgical attack to eliminate the EZLN leadership…but I haven’t heard anything since!! I hope the lack of news isn’t bad news…:( !Basta Ya! Justin
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RIGHT NOW THE ONE FUNK CREW IS SENDING THE CHIAPAS REBELS PACKETS CONTAINING ONE FUNK CREW MUSIC, PROPAGANDA, AND ADVANCE COPIES OF THE ONE FUNK CREW STORY SOON TO SHOWN ON THE USA NETWORK.
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oh my god! i thought i was the only one that felt this disappointed about other rage fans. unfortunately, they seem to be the majority. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – At their concert in Utah, 8,000 people showed up, and we had a booktable with various information, from the EZLN to Leonard Peltier, Mumia, Food Not Bombs, and Autonomy House Collective (our soon-to-be infoshop). While it was a bit disheartening to see how little many of the people knew (countless people came to our table wearing the RATM "we support our troops" Zapatista t-shirts and asked us was our big "EZLN" sign meant), but many were wanting to know more, and we have been getting a bunch of calls from people wanting to help out. Most were surprised to hear there were any anarchists in Utah… That is pretty disheartening! You probably heard about RATM’s appearance at the Tibetan Freedom Concert in San Francisco this summer? Well, I was holding a big EZLN sign during their performance, and when Zack saw it, he paused to say a few words about another "Vietnam in southern Mexico." You may have seen the exact quote in Rolling Stone (I think it was in the August issue). As he was saying those very words, some total ignorant asshole came from behind me and took the sign, tearing it up in the process. I guess I was blocking his view, but I tried to explain that Zack was at that very moment talking about the EZLN. To no avail, I suppose. Anyhow, I thought the incident was a bit ironic. Has anyone heard what’s up in Chiapas lately? About a week ago Marcos sent out a letter to the NCDM saying that the Mexican army was launching a surgical attack to eliminate the EZLN leadership…but I haven’t heard anything since!! I hope the lack of news isn’t bad news…:( !Basta Ya! Justin
dead republican: hard-edged lofi music underground milhouse studios releases: society: part one (11 songs) c/o perry fect primary (4 songs, 3 remixes) po box 320411 you can get a copy by sending a zine, fairfield ct 06432 tape, video, or a little money ($2-$5) http://www.nai.net/~perfecto
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oh my god! i thought i was the only one that felt this disappointed about other rage fans. unfortunately, they seem to be the majority.
I didn’t mean to make it sound so bad… I think most of the fans have the right spirit, but if all you know about the Zapatistas is from RATM lyrics, you won’t know much. And given the state of the mainstream media, I can see why they wouldn’t know more. The task we face is to somehow get information to the people that seek it, even though we don’t have the money for billboards, TV, etc. But we do have options… like pirate radio, book tables, flyers, talking directly with people, the internet, etc. Another thing is that most of the kids at the show were young… I’m 25 and felt pretty old. When I was 15, I didn’t know a whole lot about what was going on, but tried my best to sort it out. Since then I done a lot of reading, and most of what I know about history and current events comes from books you can’t find in a mall (though university libraries often have some great stuff). By the way, I strongly recommend Emma Goldman’s ‘Living My Life’ and Alexander Berkman’s ‘Prison Memoirs of an Anarchist’. Has anyone heard what’s up in Chiapas lately? About a week ago Marcos sent out a letter to the NCDM saying that the Mexican army was launching a surgical attack to eliminate the EZLN leadership…but I haven’t heard anything since!! I hope the lack of news isn’t bad news…:(
Last I heard, the EZLN broke off talks because of the building military presence, and the EZLN leadership plans to go to Mexico City and open up a public dialog with the people instead of the government. I got a message today or yesterday that was saying they wanted people to go to Chiapas to make sure the government doesn’t try anything. You can probably get more info if you go to my web page at the bottom of this post and go to the Zapatista page and look around… Greg
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probably get more info if you go to my web page at the bottom of this post and go to the Zapatista page and look around…
Oops… my .sig got turned off… Thats: http://www.cs.utah.edu/~galt/revolt.html Greg
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RATM do not desreve to have any info or comments poste on this group. They are not hardcore at all. They just plain old stink of hypocricy.
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!viva los Zapatistas! – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – oh my god! i thought i was the only one that felt this disappointed about other rage fans. unfortunately, they seem to be the majority. I didn’t mean to make it sound so bad… I think most of the fans have the right spirit, but if all you know about the Zapatistas is from RATM lyrics, you won’t know much. And given the state of the mainstream media, I can see why they wouldn’t know more. The task we face is to somehow get information to the people that seek it, even though we don’t have the money for billboards, TV, etc. But we do have options… like pirate radio, book tables, flyers, talking directly with people, the internet, etc. Another thing is that most of the kids at the show were young… I’m 25 and felt pretty old. When I was 15, I didn’t know a whole lot about what was going on, but tried my best to sort it out. Since then I done a lot of reading, and most of what I know about history and current events comes from books you can’t find in a mall (though university libraries often have some great stuff). By the way, I strongly recommend Emma Goldman’s ‘Living My Life’ and Alexander Berkman’s ‘Prison Memoirs of an Anarchist’. Has anyone heard what’s up in Chiapas lately? About a week ago Marcos sent out a letter to the NCDM saying that the Mexican army was launching a surgical attack to eliminate the EZLN leadership…but I haven’t heard anything since!! I hope the lack of news isn’t bad news…:( Last I heard, the EZLN broke off talks because of the building military presence, and the EZLN leadership plans to go to Mexico City and open up a public dialog with the people instead of the government. I got a message today or yesterday that was saying they wanted people to go to Chiapas to make sure the government doesn’t try anything. You can probably get more info if you go to my web page at the bottom of this post and go to the Zapatista page and look around… Greg
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Has anyone heard what’s up in Chiapas lately? About a week ago Marcos sent out a letter to the NCDM saying that the Mexican army was launching a surgical attack to eliminate the EZLN leadership…but I haven’t heard anything since!! I hope the lack of news isn’t bad news…:( Last I heard, the EZLN broke off talks because of the building military presence, and the EZLN leadership plans to go to Mexico City and open up a public dialog with the people instead of the government. I got a message today or yesterday that was saying they wanted people to go to Chiapas to make sure the government doesn’t try anything. You can probably get more info if you go to my web page at the bottom of this post and go to the Zapatista page and look around… Greg
The most recent thing that I heard is that they are waiting till after the elections (oct.29) to decide if they’re going to declare war. The determining factor will probably be whether they sniff election fraud, because Marcos has stated that it doesn’t matter if the government is right or left, so long as the government is popular. mario EZLN usa homepage http://www.igc.apc.org/ncdm
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Subcommander Marcos is definitly down with tha One Funk Crew
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oh my god! i thought i was the only one that felt this disappointed about other rage fans. unfortunately, they seem to be the majority.
Here’s the thing. I disagree with people who claim to know everything but actually know nothing. If you’re going to where a shirt with a politcal opinion, statement, group on it, at LEAST be prepared to explain what it is or what it represents. On the other hand, I think its only fair to say that those of us Rage fans deeply interested and concerned about some of the political injusitces that Rage talks about are in the minority right now. Of the people I’ve talked to, most of them like RATM for the screaming, the hardcore music, and the overall attitude of the band. None of them give a hoot about the EZLN, Che Guevara or anything else. They accept the status quo. And they are therefore entitled to this opinion. I do my best not to be judgemental of people who are just casual followers of the group rather than hardcore fans like myself and many of you. Basically, I treat people the waty I’d like them to treat me, and then offer to explain or inform these people a little bit about the shirt they’re wearing, or why they should incinerate their McD’s Adam "G.E. is gonna flex and try to annex the truth, N.B.C. is gonna flex and cast their image in you, Disney bought the fantasies and piles of eyes, And ABC’s new thrill ride of trials and lies"
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – oh my god! i thought i was the only one that felt this disappointed about other rage fans. unfortunately, they seem to be the majority. Here’s the thing. I disagree with people who claim to know everything but actually know nothing. If you’re going to where a shirt with a politcal opinion, statement, group on it, at LEAST be prepared to explain what it is or what it represents. On the other hand, I think its only fair to say that those of us Rage fans deeply interested and concerned about some of the political injusitces that Rage talks about are in the minority right now. Of the people I’ve talked to, most of them like RATM for the screaming, the hardcore music, and the overall attitude of the band. None of them give a hoot about the EZLN, Che Guevara or anything else. They accept the status quo. And they are therefore entitled to this opinion. I do my best not to be judgemental of people who are just casual followers of the group rather than hardcore fans like myself and many of you. Basically, I treat people the waty I’d like them to treat me, and then offer to explain or inform these people a little bit about the shirt they’re wearing, or why they should incinerate their McD’s Adam "G.E. is gonna flex and try to annex the truth, N.B.C. is gonna flex and cast their image in you, Disney bought the fantasies and piles of eyes, And ABC’s new thrill ride of trials and lies"
your statment is totally true.. we have a few rage fans in our school but i think only 3 which are my friends including are hardcore fans.. the rest wear those zapatista shirts and dont know jack shit of what it means… and that world ringer t-shirt and they dont even know what that symbolizes…
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du: Distribution: things have been going really well down in chiapas ever since the ONE FUNK CREW sent Floyd down there to spread the joys of the funk. now all the rebels know how to freak the sluts and mosh! ONE FUNK CREW!
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – oh my god! i thought i was the only one that felt this disappointed about other rage fans. unfortunately, they seem to be the majority. Here’s the thing. I disagree with people who claim to know everything but actually know nothing. If you’re going to where a shirt with a politcal opinion, statement, group on it, at LEAST be prepared to explain what it is or what it represents. On the other hand, I think its only fair to say that those of us Rage fans deeply interested and concerned about some of the political injusitces that Rage talks about are in the minority right now. Of the people I’ve talked to, most of them like RATM for the screaming, the hardcore music, and the overall attitude of the band. None of them give a hoot about the EZLN, Che Guevara or anything else. They accept the status quo. And they are therefore entitled to this opinion. I do my best not to be judgemental of people who are just casual followers of the group rather than hardcore fans like myself and many of you. Basically, I treat people the waty I’d like them to treat me, and then offer to explain or inform these people a little bit about the shirt they’re wearing, or why they should incinerate their McD’s Adam "G.E. is gonna flex and try to annex the truth, N.B.C. is gonna flex and cast their image in you, Disney bought the fantasies and piles of eyes, And ABC’s new thrill ride of trials and lies" your statment is totally true.. we have a few rage fans in our school but i think only 3 which are my friends including are hardcore fans.. the rest wear those zapatista shirts and dont know jack shit of what it means… and that world ringer t-shirt and they dont even know what that symbolizes…
I admit that I was drawn into Rage for the fact that I liked the Idea of liking Rage , My friends liked them, I thought I’d like, them so the next day I bought the Evil Empire Disk then a few weeks later bought the First One. I bought the World T-shirt too. But then after listening to Rage Visiting the Web Sites and Researching different Rage Topics , I now am extremely influenced by rage, I even wrote a letter to the band manager about Aol and their email address their. Aol lives on Censorship, they try to censor everything they have. I got kicked off aol for saying suck, writing in Capital letters and Sending chain letters I got a reply that said this. I’ll bring up this issue with the band. You might be seeing us on Juno soon. That was pretty cool. Aol violates the First Ammendment in every way possible. Rage knows that not all people buy their music for the issues discussed but many leave with a knowledge of what lies we are being hand fed from our government. We’ve Got To Take The POWER BACK!!
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Rage’s Politics Rage’s "selling out" Who cares! I just want to say that they dress cool. Those are some awesome duds. Yah! Party! Keepin it Real (with funk you can feel!) Sven
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hey i’m a RATT fan!! ROUND AND ROUND THIS LOVE’LL WORK IF WE JUST GIVE IT TIME ROUND AND ROUND WHAT COMES AROUND GOES AROUND!! XrattX youth crew OUT ON DA STREETS, THAT’S WHERE WE MEET. . . warren diMartini is aXoXp DFL sXaXd
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Basically, I treat people the waty I’d like them to treat me, and then offer to explain or inform these people a little bit about the shirt they’re wearing, or why they should incinerate their McD’s
That’s the key… There’s no point in getting all more-revolutionary-than-thou about it, and alienating them because of their lack of knowledge. The best we can do is to try to educate them. Just a little bit of true information can counter the years and years of bullshit they have been force-fed from school, the media, etc. Greg — Visit the Utah Anarchism and Revolution Page at: http://www.cs.utah.edu/~galt/revolt.html
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With musical taste like that, why are you dissin OFC? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -hey i’m a RATT fan!! ROUND AND ROUND THIS LOVE’LL WORK IF WE JUST GIVE IT TIME ROUND AND ROUND WHAT COMES AROUND GOES AROUND!! XrattX youth crew OUT ON DA STREETS, THAT’S WHERE WE MEET. . . warren diMartini is aXoXp DFL sXaXd
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Here’s the thing. I disagree with people who claim to know everything but actually know nothing. If you’re going to where a shirt with a politcal opinion, statement, group on it, at LEAST be prepared to explain what it is or what it represents. On the other hand, I think its only fair to say that those of us Rage fans deeply interested and concerned about some of the political injusitces that Rage talks about are in the minority right now. Of the people I’ve talked to, most of them like RATM for the screaming, the hardcore music, and the overall attitude of the band. None of them give a hoot about the EZLN, Che Guevara or anything else. They accept the status quo. And they are therefore entitled to this opinion. I do my best not to be judgemental of people who are just casual followers of the group rather than hardcore fans like myself and many of you. Basically, I treat people the waty I’d like them to treat me, and then offer to explain or inform these people a little bit about the shirt they’re wearing, or why they should incinerate their McD’s Adam "G.E. is gonna flex and try to annex the truth, N.B.C. is gonna flex and cast their image in you, Disney bought the fantasies and piles of eyes, And ABC’s new thrill ride of trials and lies" I agree with this guy. People at school wear the "We Support Our Troops" shirt, but don’t have a clue what the EZLN is. Most of the people understand less than 5% of their lyrics, and they like Rage for the swears and music. I don’t claim to know everything Zack de la Rocha sings about, but I know a hell of a lot more than most of RATM fans. I didn’t know what the EZLN is before getting involved with Rage, which isn’t supprising considering media censorship. Any anyone who says Zack’s lyrics aren’t meaningfull is full of shit and should get edjucated. "If ignorance is bliss, then knock the smile of my face."
i’d say 3/4s of the fans need to educate themselves when listening to rage… i remeber zack saying something about this issue at a concert…. he said "if the message is not getting to your head maybe i should fucking leave"
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I was wondering why is rage using aol? censorship is big there….
Could this be someone waking up and smelling the coffee?
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With musical taste like that, why are you dissin OFC?
Hey Phil, I have to agree with super-assassin here. He’s quoting one of the best Ratt songs. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – hey i’m a RATT fan!! ROUND AND ROUND THIS LOVE’LL WORK IF WE JUST GIVE IT TIME ROUND AND ROUND WHAT COMES AROUND GOES AROUND!!
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YEAH JOANIE!!!YOU GO GIRL!! sXaXd aXoXp – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – With musical taste like that, why are you dissin OFC? Hey Phil, I have to agree with super-assassin here. He’s quoting one of the best Ratt songs. hey i’m a RATT fan!! ROUND AND ROUND THIS LOVE’LL WORK IF WE JUST GIVE IT TIME ROUND AND ROUND WHAT COMES AROUND GOES AROUND!!
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I didn’t know what the EZLN is before getting involved with Rage, which isn’t supprising considering media censorship. Any anyone who says Zack’s lyrics aren’t meaningfull is full of shit and should get edjucated. "If ignorance is bliss, then knock the smile of my face."
somebody phocking worte back: i’d say 3/4s of the fans need to educate themselves when listening to rage…
Who are you to say how many of the fans need to educate themselves? Did you count the Million Man March or something? You are a kid or young person who sees other young people. I myself am a young people [18]. I have no idea how many rage fans their are. I have an even smaller idea how many of them devote themselves to the causes RATM stands for. I don’t care. There is no way you can justify what you said and I am responding to call you on it because it was a very dumb and thoughless thing to say. I am also Muslim. We have this saying [if you want to call it that] basically it says the the Qu’ran [Muslim Bible if you want to call it that.] will only sway and move those who God wants it to move. The only people who will be impressed with Islam and want to become Muslims will be people who God want’s to become Muslims. Rage is a band. I’m sure that if you asked sony what the purpose of rage was, they would say, "To sell us records." That’s the way it is. Let the kids were the shirts hassle free. Those who are mature enough to take interest in the causes WILL when the see a shirt and Zack’s overpowering charm comes through. If they buy the album and listen to it twice and then go back to buying $200 dollar Nikes, that’s fine, IT WASN’T MEANT FOR THEM. — Jesus Ali http://www2.corenet.net/jesusali
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"I myself am"…… "full of shit and should get edjucated." Well considering you spelled educated wrong you’re pretty much dead on on your self description!!! Up da fukin Punx!!!
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"I myself am"…… "full of shit and should get edjucated." Well considering you spelled educated wrong you’re pretty much dead on on your self description!!! Up da fukin Punx!!!
Boy dan, you’re real cool. Speaking of getting educated, maybe you should LEARN HOW TO READ A FUCKING THREADED NEWSGROUP CONVERSATION BEFORE YOU TRY TO SLAM SOMEONE ON THE INTERNET! If had TWO testicles and were so hot to try and look cool on the internet you would have noticed that I DIDN’T TYPE WHAT YOU QUOTED ME AS TYPING. I didn’t know what the EZLN is before getting involved with Rage, which isn’t supprising considering media censorship. Any anyone who says Zack’s lyrics aren’t meaningfull is full of shit and should get edjucated."
SOMEBODY PHUCKING WROTE !!! NOT ME! I was QUOTING THEM! Later in the email I title which words are mine. Congrat’s on looking like an ass ol’danny boy. — Jesus Ali http://www2.corenet.net/jesusali
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Yeah, we need a government administered health care system so we can be as healthy as the British, and as well looked after as those cared for by the Veterans Administration. Just what we need; a plan to institutionalize
The implications of this submission have been refuted time and again on this network. People should take the time to read such refutations and address the issues raised instead of just spouting off this sort of dogmatic drivel. Peter Lauren.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Percentage of Americans which found the following "very important" to promote family values: — Creating a National Health Care Program: 83 percent — Spending more money on education: 88 percent — Spending more on Day Care for children: 79 percent Gee. Are these the same people that — want the budget balanced — want the economy to recover quickly — want jobs for everyone — are mad at the "no new taxes" turnaround — don’t want the government to tax them anymore — are educated by our wonderful American educational system?
Yep. They’re also the same people that vote. You fools that live and die by these "polls" might benefit from a class in psychology. Ask people if they think "x" is good, without spelling out the realities of such a decision mean about zero in terms of what these same people would actually say if given the entire picture.
Yes, but which scenario more closely resembles an election? The former, of course. Think.
Vote. Better yet, do both. — (uucp: …!rutgers!depot!mccall!tp) 615 McCall Road (800)255-2762, in KS (913)776-4041 Manhattan, KS 66502, USA
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Percentage of Americans which found the following "very important" to promote family values: — Creating a National Health Care Program: 83 percent — Spending more money on education: 88 percent — Spending more on Day Care for children: 79 percent [AP wire story, New York dateline, Mon Aug. 24, 1992, p.17 cited in Cornell's _The Cornell Daily Sun_] - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – – [Send the 1-line message GET HEALTH INSURANC ACTIV-L to ] – [Send GET ACTIV-L ARCHIVE ACTIV-L to above address for a ] [listing with brief descriptions of other files available] - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – - – To get a file named FILE NAME from the archiver (files are two words separa- ted by a space), send the 1-line message GET FILE NAME ACTIV-L Use GET with the file ACTIV-L ARCHIVE for a listing of files available with the GET command. emailed the index of archived files.
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Percentage of Americans which found the following "very important" to promote family values: — Creating a National Health Care Program: 83 percent — Spending more money on education: 88 percent
Kind of says something about how well informed the electorate is, doesn’t it? That, or how questions are phrased in a poll. "If spending more money would make for better education in this country, would you support the increase?" Well, sure. But we’ve seen plenty to show us that spending money on education isn’t going to do a damn thing other than improve the lifestyles of teachers and school administrators. We know this, and we have evidence the NEA believes this as well- that’s why they’re so afraid of school choice programs. Once those on the public school gravy train have to compete based on *results* it would be a different story. Yeah, we need a government administered health care system so we can be as healthy as the British, and as well looked after as those cared for by the Veterans Administration. Just what we need; a plan to institutionalize what’s wrong with the current fee-for-service system. Those with a memory that goes back before 1960 might remember that the AMA once fought *all* medical insurance tooth-and-nail…until they discovered they could make *more* money through fee-for-service. Now they’re fighting HMOs, which limit the amount of money MDs can make and reduce costs overall. But government helath insurance will be all fee-for-service…and they can make out like all the bandits who specialize in Medicare service. Come by my house one day and I’ll show you a three-story clinic a few blocks away that was paid for entirely by the cataract surgeries done by *one* doctor. And as for child care…the state has put in plenty of regulations that make it impossible for individuals to run small neighborhood child care facilities. Enough to guarentee that unless youy’re upper-middle-class you’l eventually *need* to use a subsidized state-run child care service. Just like with education. Sense a pattern? 
Michael Joseph Edelman Wayne State University KE8YY
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Percentage of Americans which found the following "very important" to promote family values: — Creating a National Health Care Program: 83 percent — Spending more money on education: 88 percent — Spending more on Day Care for children: 79 percent
Gee. Are these the same people that – want the budget balanced – want the economy to recover quickly – want jobs for everyone – are mad at the "no new taxes" turnaround – don’t want the government to tax them anymore – are educated by our wonderful American educational system? By Clinton’s own (extremely optimistic) estimates, he would raise taxes by $197 billion over 4 years to pay for social programs and capital projects. A long term care bill proposed by congressional democrats would cost an estimated $45 billion ANNUALLY! The Senate bill that mirrors Clinton’s proposal for health care assumed a payroll tax increase of 7% for businesses. Now that will get the job market thriving again, won’t it! You fools that live and die by these "polls" might benefit from a class in psychology. Ask people if they think "x" is good, without spelling out the realities of such a decision mean about zero in terms of what these same people would actually say if given the entire picture. Think.
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