Filed under: Media activism
Question:
Army Admits It Staged Toppling of Saddam Statue
This is a surprise to you? Did you -really think that US Army tank retriever came out of some Iraqi’s garage? —
Response:
Army Admits It Staged Toppling of Saddam Statue This is a surprise to you? Did you -really think that US Army tank retriever came out of some Iraqi’s garage? —
Uh….no, Burnt, as the title, "We Told you So: Army Admits It Staged Toppling of Saddam Statue" should imply to anyone with basic reading skills, it comes as no surprise. If you’re still confused, though, Google "Saddam statue", and read what we said at the time, and what you freepers had to say in rebuttal.
Response:
read what we said at the time, and what you freepers had to say in rebuttal
Who is "we", and what’s a "freeper"? —
Response:
Army Admits It Staged Toppling of Saddam Statue This is a surprise to you? Did you -really think that US Army tank retriever came out of some Iraqi’s garage?
Why not …? The WMD’s Saddam had in the late 80’s, and the systems to manufacture, target and deliver them were supplied and facilitated by the U$$A … PS: How’s Buster? — "The most important thing is for us to find Osama bin Laden. It is our number one priority and we will not rest until we find him." ~ George Bush Jr. 2001-09-13 "I don’t know where he (bin Laden) is. I have no idea and I really don’t care. It’s not that important. It’s not our priority." ~ George Bush Jr. 2002-03-13 "I was not prepared to shoot my eardrum out with a shotgun in order to get a deferment. Not was I willing to go to Canada. So I chose to better myself by learning how to fly airplanes." ~George W. Bush on how he dodged the Vietnam draft—1994
Response:
Army Admits It Staged Toppling of Saddam Statue A newly declassified Army study of the Iraq invasion confirms that the U.S. military stage-managed the fall of Saddam Hussein’s statue in Baghdad. According to the Army’s own report, a Marine colonel decided to topple the statue and an Army psyops worked to make the toppling of the statue appear to be a spontaneous undertaking by Iraqi civilians. This according to the Los Angeles Times. The psyops team used loudspeakers to encourage Iraqis to gather in Firdos Square and a Marine recovery vehicle was used to topple the statue with a chain. U.S. Censors Portions Of Saddam Hussein Hearing The US military censored major portions of Saddam Hussein’s hearing last week. The military ordered camera crews not to record the audio of the proceedings. They ordered stations not to broadcast images of Saddam being led into the courtroom in handcuffs. And the military edited out portions of the proceedings when it released the audio to news outlets. According to Robert Fisk of the London Independent, the US cut out Saddam saying "this is theatre–Bush is the real criminal." Unedited audio of most of the proceedings made it out only because news crews pretended not to be recording under US orders. One U.S. television crew member said of the U.S. military officials "They were running the show. The Americans decided what the world could and could not see of this trial–and it was meant to be an Iraqi trial." Headlines from http://www.DemocracyNow.org = = = = STILL FEELING LIKE THE MAINSTREAM U.S. CORPORATE MEDIA IS GIVING A FULL HONEST PICTURE OF WHAT’S GOING ON? = = = = Daily online radio show, news reporting: www.DemocracyNow.org = = = = Sorry, we cannot read/reply to most usenet posts but welcome email For more information: http://EconomicDemocracy.org/wtc/ (peace) And http://EconomicDemocracy.org/ (general) ** ANTI-SPAM EMAIL NOTE: For email "info" and "map" don’t work. Email to ** m-a-i-l-m-a-i-l (without the dashes) at economicdemocracy.org instead
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Question:
BBC Online: Passive smoke risk ‘even greater’ Not if the tobacco companies were to remove all the chemicals they add to the tobacco and to the paper.
May be more truth to that, even for first-hand smoke. It’s the nicotine which brings ‘em back, but that’s apparently not what does the damage. William R. James
Response:
They produced a giant "prescription" signed by doctors calling on government to impose such a ban.
Socialist control freaks with no respect for the rights of others always seem to "prescribe" that others’ rights be banned. William R. James
Response:
BBC Online: Passive smoke risk ‘even greater’ The risks of passive smoking could be twice as bad as previously feared, the British Medical Journal has reported. Researchers from London’s St George’s Medical School and the Royal Free hospital found passive smoking increased the risk of coronary heart disease by 50-60%. The team, which studied 4,792 men over 20 years, said earlier studies which had found a 25-30% increased risk focused on people living with smokers. They did not take account of exposure at work and other places, it added. The true effects of passive smoking may have been underestimated Professor Peter Whincup Doctors at the British Medical Association conference this week have called for a workplace smoking ban. They produced a giant "prescription" signed by doctors calling on government to impose such a ban. Delegates at the conference also heard that 4,500 letters from doctors concerned about the negative health effects of tobacco would to be sent to the Prime Minister. It is reported that the government is considering a ban on smoking in all public places if it wins the next election. Previous research has linked passive smoking to increased risk of heart disease and stroke. Underestimates St George’s Hospital’s Professor Peter Whincup and colleagues examined the links between a blood marker of smoke exposure, called cotinine, and the risk of heart disease and stroke in more than 4,500 men. The men were aged between 40 and 59 and came from 18 different towns across the UK. They were monitored for 20 years. Professor Whincup’s team found the men with the highest levels of cotinine in their blood, and therefore the highest exposure to passive smoke, had the highest risk of heart disease. Higher cotinine levels were linked with a 50-60% greater risk of heart disease. Previous studies that looked at the risk posed by living with a smoker estimated a 25-30% increased risk of heart disease. This suggests the dangers of passive smoking may have been underestimated, according to the researchers. The risks were particularly high when they looked over a short time scale, which suggests the link between cotinine levels and heart disease declines with time. This means previous studies that looked at years of data could have further underestimated the risk, they said. Professor Whincup and colleagues did not find any link between cotinine level and stroke risk, however. The need for a ban on smoking in public places in the UK has never been better illustrated than by this potentially pivotal study Dr Tim Bowker, associate medical director at the British Heart Foundation Professor Whincup said: "The true effects of passive smoking may have been underestimated by concentrating on partner exposure. "What we have here is a measure of overall passive smoking exposure. "The effects of passive smoking are likely to be bigger and more widespread. This adds weight to the argument that we should do everything we can to minimise passive smoking exposure," he said. Action needed Dr Tim Bowker, associate medical director of the British Heart Foundation, said: "The need for a ban on smoking in public places in the UK has never been better illustrated than by this potentially pivotal study. "The evidence is now compelling. The government should not delay any further in introducing legislation to protect non-smokers from this unnecessary risk," he said. Mr Ian Willmore, head of communications at Action on Smoking and Health, said: "If you regularly breathe in other people’s smoke at home or at work your chances of getting heart disease may rise by more than a half. "This is a much bigger increase in risk than was previously thought – and the difference with previous estimates seems mainly due to smoking in the workplace. "It is time for the tobacco industry and its front organisations to stop pretending that second-hand smoke is harmless. And it is time for the Government to accept the need for a new law to end smoking in the workplace," he said. At the British Medical Association’s annual conference, Dr Peter Maguire, a consultant from Northern Ireland and the Deputy Chairman of the BMA Board of Sciences, called for a ban on smoking in public places and the workplace. "The British government needs to have courage and follow the lead of Ireland, New York and Norway. "I have seen that the ban on smoking in public places in Ireland has not affected business – business is booming there. Smoke free places mean life not death," he said. A spokesman from the smoker’s lobby group Forest said the jury was still out on whether passive smoking kills. "This new report needs to be seen in perspective. It is one of over a hundred studies on the subject and the vast majority have failed to find any connection between passive smoking and ill health. On the few occasions a link has been detected it has been too small to be significant. "The truth is, we don’t know whether passive smoking is harmful. Until passive smoking is proved to be a serious health risk it is unacceptable to use it as an excuse to outlaw smoking in public places," he said. The Tobacco Manufacturers’ Association said: "There continues to be scientific disagreement over the potentially harmful effects of passive smoking. Last year, the BMJ said the risk may have been overstated. Now a new study claims the risk has been underestimated, and only last week, Sir Richard Doll reconfirmed his view that the risk is small. "It does appear that there is not sufficient scientific evidence to justify a total smoking ban in public places. But action should still be taken to ensure non smokers’ needs are catered for by designated non-smoking and smoking areas, together with good ventilation." http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/health/3850083.stm = = = = STILL FEELING LIKE THE MAINSTREAM U.S. CORPORATE MEDIA IS GIVING A FULL HONEST PICTURE OF WHAT’S GOING ON? = = = = Daily online radio show, news reporting: www.DemocracyNow.org = = = = Sorry, we cannot read/reply to most usenet posts but welcome email For more information: http://EconomicDemocracy.org/wtc/ (peace) And http://EconomicDemocracy.org/ (general) ** ANTI-SPAM EMAIL NOTE: For email "info" and "map" don’t work. Email instead ** to m-a-i-l-m-a-i-l (without the dashes) at economicdemocracy.org
Response:
Question:
Bill Bonde ( “I could have nailed the St. Helena goat’s pelt to the In the next 100 years, unless immediate action is taken, carbon dioxide levels will rise to between 800 and 1,000 parts per million. You need to be less whiny.
You need to be smarter.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – In the next 100 years, unless immediate action is taken, carbon dioxide levels will rise to between 800 and 1,000 parts per million. The last time carbon dioxide was that high was during the Eocene, 55 to 36 million years ago," Schrag added. At that time "palm trees lived in Wyoming, crocodiles lived in the Arctic, Antarctica was a pine forest and sea level was at least 300 feet higher than today." [Note for the past 400,000 years CO2 ranged between 180 and 280 parts per million. Since the industrial revolution that has gone up, then accelerated, and in the last year alone it rose from 376 to 379, about 100 part per million above the TOP of the range (above that 280 parts per million. This 379 is wehre we stand today, and it will keep goign up for years to come even if we stopped burning fossil fuels tomorrow..but if we don't burn less, it will not just go up, but accelerate even faster.. -ED] Climate Change Experts Despair Over U.S. Attitude Tue Jun 15,12:10 PM ET By Maggie Fox, Health and Science Correspondent WASHINGTON (Reuters) – Climate change experts said on Tuesday they are frustrated the U.S. government and the public are not taking the risk of global warming seriously. They said even as sea levels rise and crop yields fall, officials argue over whether climate change is real and Americans continue to drive fuel-guzzling SUVs. "There is going to be large change," said atmospheric scientist David Battisti of the University of Washington in Seattle. "The risks are very large." The group met at the American Association for the Advancement of Science (news – web sites) to try to drive home the message that climate change is already under way. "You hope that somehow people will understand that we have got to do something now," Joyce Penner, an atmospheric scientist at the University of Michigan, said in an interview. "Some people get it — some people are driving hybrids. But there is a problem with the American public." Climate experts around the world agree one first step to battling the buildup of polluting gases that is warming the Earth is an agreement called the Kyoto Protocol (news – web sites), a 1997 pact aimed at reducing greenhouse emissions. More than 120 nations have ratified the pact or acceded to it. President Bush (news – web sites) pulled out in 2001, arguing Kyoto was too expensive and unfairly excluded developing nations. The United States is the world’s biggest polluter, producing 36 percent of warming emissions. Bush’s advisers also cite doubts about models that predict the course of global warming. UNDERESTIMATING THE THREAT The climate experts agreed there is debate about the models but say if anything, they underestimate the extent of the problem. "The models … are good enough to tell us we ought to be starting now to do what we can to reduce emissions," said Michael Oppenheimer, a professor of environmental science at Princeton University. Oppenheimer said sea levels have risen 4 inches (9 cm) already over the past century and could rise between 4 and 40 inches (9 to 88 cm) more in the next century. Both the Greenland and the West Antarctic ice sheets are "highly vulnerable" to global warming, Oppenheimer said. If completely melted, the Greenland ice sheet would add 25 feet to overall sea level and the West Antarctic Ice Sheet would raise it by 16 feet. This would be enough to swamp most of Florida, Bangladesh and Manhattan, he said. "The sea level rise over the past century appears greater than what the model says it should be," Oppenheimer said. "The ice sheets may be contributing more than the models predict." The researchers said they hoped to convince the U.S. public to pressure politicians into policy changes. "In this country it depends a lot on what happens in the next election," said geochemist Daniel Schrag of Harvard University. "I don’t think we can expect to change the minds of this administration in the next couple of months." Schrag said the current concentration of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere is 380 parts per million — higher than it has been for at least the past 430,000 years. "In the next 100 years, unless immediate action is taken, carbon dioxide levels will rise to between 800 and 1,000 parts per million. The last time carbon dioxide was that high was during the Eocene, 55 to 36 million years ago," Schrag added. At that time he said "palm trees lived in Wyoming, crocodiles lived in the Arctic, Antarctica was a pine forest and sea level was at least 300 feet higher than today." http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=570&ncid=753&e=1&u=/n…
The atmosphere will never reach 1,000 parts per million. By about the middle of this century, the world will run out of oil and natural gas and therefore stop adding large amounts of CO2. Nothing to worry about.
Response:
In the next 100 years, unless immediate action is taken, carbon dioxide levels will rise to between 800 and 1,000 parts per million.
You need to be less whiny. — "I always vote for the most stupid." -+Georges Clemenceau
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Bill Bonde ( “I could have nailed the St. Helena goat’s pelt to the In the next 100 years, unless immediate action is taken, carbon dioxide levels will rise to between 800 and 1,000 parts per million. You need to be less whiny. You need to be smarter.
Why? — "I always vote for the most stupid." -+Georges Clemenceau
Response:
In the next 100 years, unless immediate action is taken, carbon dioxide levels will rise to between 800 and 1,000 parts per million. The last time carbon dioxide was that high was during the Eocene, 55 to 36 million years ago," Schrag added. At that time "palm trees lived in Wyoming, crocodiles lived in the Arctic, Antarctica was a pine forest and sea level was at least 300 feet higher than today." [Note for the past 400,000 years CO2 ranged between 180 and 280 parts per million. Since the industrial revolution that has gone up, then accelerated, and in the last year alone it rose from 376 to 379, about 100 part per million above the TOP of the range (above that 280 parts per million. This 379 is wehre we stand today, and it will keep goign up for years to come even if we stopped burning fossil fuels tomorrow..but if we don't burn less, it will not just go up, but accelerate even faster.. -ED] Climate Change Experts Despair Over U.S. Attitude Tue Jun 15,12:10 PM ET By Maggie Fox, Health and Science Correspondent WASHINGTON (Reuters) – Climate change experts said on Tuesday they are frustrated the U.S. government and the public are not taking the risk of global warming seriously. They said even as sea levels rise and crop yields fall, officials argue over whether climate change is real and Americans continue to drive fuel-guzzling SUVs. "There is going to be large change," said atmospheric scientist David Battisti of the University of Washington in Seattle. "The risks are very large." The group met at the American Association for the Advancement of Science (news – web sites) to try to drive home the message that climate change is already under way. "You hope that somehow people will understand that we have got to do something now," Joyce Penner, an atmospheric scientist at the University of Michigan, said in an interview. "Some people get it — some people are driving hybrids. But there is a problem with the American public." Climate experts around the world agree one first step to battling the buildup of polluting gases that is warming the Earth is an agreement called the Kyoto Protocol (news – web sites), a 1997 pact aimed at reducing greenhouse emissions. More than 120 nations have ratified the pact or acceded to it. President Bush (news – web sites) pulled out in 2001, arguing Kyoto was too expensive and unfairly excluded developing nations. The United States is the world’s biggest polluter, producing 36 percent of warming emissions. Bush’s advisers also cite doubts about models that predict the course of global warming. UNDERESTIMATING THE THREAT The climate experts agreed there is debate about the models but say if anything, they underestimate the extent of the problem. "The models … are good enough to tell us we ought to be starting now to do what we can to reduce emissions," said Michael Oppenheimer, a professor of environmental science at Princeton University. Oppenheimer said sea levels have risen 4 inches (9 cm) already over the past century and could rise between 4 and 40 inches (9 to 88 cm) more in the next century. Both the Greenland and the West Antarctic ice sheets are "highly vulnerable" to global warming, Oppenheimer said. If completely melted, the Greenland ice sheet would add 25 feet to overall sea level and the West Antarctic Ice Sheet would raise it by 16 feet. This would be enough to swamp most of Florida, Bangladesh and Manhattan, he said. "The sea level rise over the past century appears greater than what the model says it should be," Oppenheimer said. "The ice sheets may be contributing more than the models predict." The researchers said they hoped to convince the U.S. public to pressure politicians into policy changes. "In this country it depends a lot on what happens in the next election," said geochemist Daniel Schrag of Harvard University. "I don’t think we can expect to change the minds of this administration in the next couple of months." Schrag said the current concentration of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere is 380 parts per million — higher than it has been for at least the past 430,000 years. "In the next 100 years, unless immediate action is taken, carbon dioxide levels will rise to between 800 and 1,000 parts per million. The last time carbon dioxide was that high was during the Eocene, 55 to 36 million years ago," Schrag added. At that time he said "palm trees lived in Wyoming, crocodiles lived in the Arctic, Antarctica was a pine forest and sea level was at least 300 feet higher than today." http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=570&ncid=753&e=1&u=/n… DON’T MOURN, ACT! WEBSITES FOR ACTION: http://www.greenhousenet.org/ http://www.gristmagazine.com/dogood/climate.asp http://www.solarcatalyst.com/ Overview and local actions you can take: http://www.PostCarbon.org = = = = STILL FEELING LIKE THE MAINSTREAM U.S. CORPORATE MEDIA IS GIVING A FULL HONEST PICTURE OF WHAT’S GOING ON? = = = = Daily online radio show, news reporting: www.DemocracyNow.org = = = = Sorry, we cannot read/reply to most usenet posts but welcome email For more information: http://EconomicDemocracy.org/wtc/ (peace) And http://EconomicDemocracy.org/ (general) ** ANTI-SPAM EMAIL NOTE: For email "info" and "map" don’t work. Email instead ** to m-a-i-l-m-a-i-l (without the dashes) at economicdemocracy.org
Response:
Question:
Only the school kids were watching Bush at that time. It is more likely he was so confused and panicked that he could only continue on his present course.
He was probably thinking, "this is what I get for selling out to the Saudis." Bush is a criminal. Walt
Response:
"Former President Bush does not support the war against Iraq," says former aide John Ruskin. "It is as simple at that."
i find it near impossible to believe that gw would go to war against his dad’s wishes. after all, the current cabinet is all bush, sr people. however, bush, sr’s own book predicted the exact troubles we’re having now, and i’ve asked before why he’s staying so low-profile at this time. the best action against hussein was to isolate him and keep him under the microscope. of course, that’s what turned him into the weirdo with the ‘velvet elvis’ paintings, sex parties and random extreme torture. what else could he do? again: q u a g m i r e — TheTruthHurts.
Response:
- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – But Bush’s desire to please his father may have backfired. Former President George H.W. Bush has remained silent publicly about the war, saying he will only discuss it with his son "in private." Close aides say that is because he disapproves of his son’s actions against Iraq. "Former President Bush does not support the war against Iraq," says former aide John Ruskin. "It is as simple at that." While conservative critics who have not yet seen Fahrenheit 9/11 dismiss the work as an anti-Bush screed, Roger Friedman of the normally pro-Bush Fox News Network has seen the film and calls it "a tribute to patriotism, to the American sense of duty ? and at the same time a indictment of stupidity and avarice." Friedman also says the films "most indelible moment" comes when Bush, speaking to a group of school kids in Florida, is first informed of the 9/11 attacks. "Instead of jumping up and leaving, he instead sat in front of the class, with an unfortunate look of confusion, for nearly 11 minutes," Friedman says. "Moore obtained the footage from a teacher at the school who videotaped the morning program. There Bush sits, with no access to his advisers, while New York is being viciously attacked. I guarantee you that no one who sees this film forgets this episode."
Actually I thought that was one of Bush’s finest moments. He was able to come up with and project just the right image at a time when literaly the whole world was watching. Any demands of the president for info and action at that time would be counterproductive. The FAA was busy getting all planes down on the ground. Would a call from the President at that time do anything but distract the FAA from that effort? Should Bush have called Rudy Giuliani at that time?
Response:
Bill
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – But Bush’s desire to please his father may have backfired. Former President George H.W. Bush has remained silent publicly about the war, saying he will only discuss it with his son "in private." Close aides say that is because he disapproves of his son’s actions against Iraq. "Former President Bush does not support the war against Iraq," says former aide John Ruskin. "It is as simple at that." While conservative critics who have not yet seen Fahrenheit 9/11 dismiss the work as an anti-Bush screed, Roger Friedman of the normally pro-Bush Fox News Network has seen the film and calls it "a tribute to patriotism, to the American sense of duty ? and at the same time a indictment of stupidity and avarice." Friedman also says the films "most indelible moment" comes when Bush, speaking to a group of school kids in Florida, is first informed of the 9/11 attacks. "Instead of jumping up and leaving, he instead sat in front of the class, with an unfortunate look of confusion, for nearly 11 minutes," Friedman says. "Moore obtained the footage from a teacher at the school who videotaped the morning program. There Bush sits, with no access to his advisers, while New York is being viciously attacked. I guarantee you that no one who sees this film forgets this episode." Actually I thought that was one of Bush’s finest moments. He was able to come up with and project just the right image at a time when literaly the whole world was watching.
Only the school kids were watching Bush at that time. It is more likely he was so confused and panicked that he could only continue on his present course. Any demands of the president for info and action at that time would be counterproductive.
What is counter productive about getting the facts on what was happening and making sure that the government was dealing with the problem appropriately? The FAA – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – was busy getting all planes down on the ground. Would a call from the President at that time do anything but distract the FAA from that effort? Should Bush have called Rudy Giuliani at that time?
Response:
Special Report. http://www.onlinejournal.com/Special_Reports/052104Madsen/052104madse… Karl Rove’s White House " Murder, Inc." By Wayne Madsen Online Journal Contributing Writer May , 2004- On September 15, 2001, just four days after the 9-11 attacks, CIA Director George Tenet provided President [sic] Bush with a Top Secret "Worldwide Attack Matrix"-a virtual license to kill targets deemed to be a threat to the United States in some 80 countries around the world. The Tenet plan, which was subsequently approved by Bush, essentially reversed the executive orders of four previous U.S. administrations that expressly prohibited political assassinations. According to high level European intelligence officials, Bush’s counselor, Karl Rove, used the new presidential authority to silence a popular Lebanese Christian politician who was planning to offer irrefutable evidence that Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon authorized the massacre of hundreds of Palestinian men, women, and children in the Beirut refugee camps of Sabra and Shatilla in 1982. In addition, Sharon provided the Lebanese forces who carried out the grisly task. At the time of the massacres, Elie Hobeika was intelligence chief of Lebanese Christian forces in Lebanon who were battling Palestinians and other Muslim groups in a bloody civil war. He was also the chief liaison to Israeli Defense Force (IDF) personnel in Lebanon. An official Israeli inquiry into the massacre at the camps, the Kahan Commission, merely found Sharon "indirectly" responsible for the slaughter and fingered Hobeika as the chief instigator. The Kahan Commission never called on Hobeika to offer testimony in his defense. However, in response to charges brought against Sharon before a special war crimes court in Belgium, Hobeika was urged to testify against Sharon, according to well-informed Lebanese sources. Hobeika was prepared to offer a different version of events than what was contained in the Kahan report. A 1993 Belgian law permitting human rights prosecutions was unusual in that non-Belgians could be tried for violations against other non-Belgians in a Belgian court. Under pressure from the Bush administration, the law was severely amended and the extra territoriality provisions were curtailed. Hobeika headed the Lebanese forces intelligence agency since the mid- 1970s and he soon developed close ties to the CIA. He was a frequent visitor to the CIA’s headquarters at Langley, Virginia. After the Syrian invasion of Lebanon in 1990, Hobeika held a number of cabinet positions in the Lebanese government, a proxy for the Syrian occupation authorities. He also served in the parliament. In July 2001, Hobeika called a press conference and announced he was prepared to testify against Sharon in Belgium and revealed that he had evidence of what actually occurred in Sabra and Shatilla. Hobeika also indicated that Israel had flown members of the South Lebanon Army (SLA) into Beirut International Airport in an Israeli Air Force C130 transport plane. In full view of dozens of witnesses, including members of the Lebanese army and others, SLA troops under the command of Major Saad Haddad were slipped into the camps to commit the massacres. The SLA troops were under the direct command of Ariel Sharon and an Israeli Mossad agent provocateur named Rafi Eitan. Hobeika offered evidence that a former U.S. ambassador to Lebanon was aware of the Israeli plot. In addition, the IDF had placed a camera in a strategic position to film the Sabra and Shatilla massacres. Hobeika was going to ask that the footage be released as part of the investigation of Sharon. After announcing he was willing to testify against Sharon, Hobeika became fearful for his safety and began moves to leave Lebanon. Hobeika was not aware that his threats to testify against Sharon had triggered a series of fateful events that reached well into the White House and Sharon’s office. On January 24, 2002, Hobeika’s car was blown up by a remote controlled bomb placed in a parked Mercedes along a street in the Hazmieh section of Beirut. The bomb exploded when Hobeika and his three associates, Fares Souweidan, Mitri Ajram, and Waleed Zein, were driving their Range Rover past the TNT-laden Mercedes at 9:40 am Beirut time. The Range Rover’s four passengers were killed in the explosion. In case Hobeika’s car had taken another route through the neighborhood, two additional parked cars, located at two other choke points, were also rigged with TNT. The powerful bomb wounded a number of other people on the street. Other parked cars were destroyed and buildings and homes were damaged. The Lebanese president, prime minister, and interior minister all claimed that Israeli agents were behind the attack. It is noteworthy that the State Department’s list of global terrorist incidents for 2002 worldwide failed to list the car bombing attack on Hobeika and his party. The White House wanted to ensure the attack was censored from the report. The reason was simple: the attack ultimately had Washington’s fingerprints on it. High level European intelligence sources now report that Karl Rove personally coordinated Hobeika’s assassination. The hit on Hobeika employed Syrian intelligence agents. Syrian President Bashar Assad was trying to curry favor with the Bush administration in the aftermath of 9-11 and was more than willing to help the White House. In addition, Assad’s father, Hafez Assad, had been an ally of Bush’s father during Desert Storm, a period that saw Washington give a "wink and a nod" to Syria’s occupation of Lebanon. Rove wanted to help Sharon avoid any political embarrassment from an in absentia trial in Brussels where Hobeika would be a star witness. Rove and Sharon agreed on the plan to use Syrian Military Intelligence agents to assassinate Hobeika. Rove saw Sharon as an indispensable ally of Bush in ensuring the loyalty of the Christian evangelical and Jewish voting blocs in the United States. Sharon saw the plan to have the United States coordinate the hit as a way to mask all connections to Jerusalem. The Syrian hit team was ordered by Assef Shawkat, the number two man in Syrian military intelligence and a good friend and brother in law of Syrian President Bashar Assad. Assad’s intelligence services had already cooperated with U.S. intelligence in resorting to unconventional methods to extract information from al Qaeda detainees deported to Syria from the United States and other countries in the wake of 9-11. The order to take out Hobeika was transmitted by Shawkat to Roustom Ghazali, the head of Syrian military intelligence in Beirut. Ghazali arranged for the three remote controlled cars to be parked along Hobeika’s route in Hazmieh; only few hundred yards from the Barracks of Syrian Special Forces which are stationed in the area near the Presidential palace , the ministry of Defense and various Government and officers quarters . This particular area is covered 24/7 by a very sophisticated USA multi-agency surveillance system to monitor Syrian and Lebanese security activities and is a " Choice " area to live in for its perceived high security . The plan to kill Hobeika had all the necessary caveats and built-in denial mechanisms. If the Syrians were discovered beforehand or afterwards, Karl Rove and his associates in the Pentagon’s Office of Special Plans would be ensured plausible deniability. Hobeika’s CIA intermediary in Beirut, a man only referred to as "Jason" by Hobeika, was a frequent companion of the Lebanese politician during official and off-duty hours. During Hobeika’s election campaigns for his parliamentary seat, Jason was often in Hobeika’s office offering support and advice. After Hobeika’s assassination, Jason became despondent over the death of his colleague. Eventually, Jason disappeared abruptly from Lebanon and reportedly later emerged in Pakistan. Karl Rove’s involvement in the assassination of Hobeika may not have been the last "hit" he ordered to help out Sharon. In March 2002, a few months after Hobeika’s assassination, another Lebanese Christian with knowledge of Sharon’s involvement in the Sabra and Shatilla massacres was gunned down along with his wife in Sao Paulo, Brazil. A bullet fired at Michael Nassar’s car flattened one of his tires. Nassar pulled into a gasoline station for repairs. A professional assassin, firing a gun with a silencer, shot Nassar and his wife in the head, killing them both instantly. The assailant fled and was never captured. Nassar was also involved with the Phalange militia at Sabra and Shatilla. Nassar was also reportedly willing to testify against Sharon in Belgium and, as a nephew of SLA Commander General Antoine Lahd, may have had important evidence to bolster Hobeika’s charge that Sharon ordered SLA forces into the camps to wipe out the Palestinians. Based on what European intelligence claims is concrete intelligence on Rove’s involvement in the assassination of Hobeika, the Bush administration can now add political assassination to its laundry list of other misdeeds, from lying about the reasons to go to war to the torture tactics in violation of the Geneva Conventions that have been employed by the Pentagon and "third country" nationals at prisons in Iraq and Guantanamo Bay. Wayne Madsen is a Washington, DC-based investigative journalist and columnist. He served in the National Security Agency (NSA) during the Reagan administration and wrote the introduction to Forbidden Truth. He is the co-author, with John Stanton, of "America’s Nightmare: The Presidency of George Bush II." His forthcoming book is titled: "Jaded Tasks: Big Oil, Black Ops, and Brass Plates." Madsen can be reached at:
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But Bush’s desire to please his father may have backfired. Former President George H.W. Bush has remained silent publicly about the war, saying he will only discuss it with his son "in private." Close aides say that is because he disapproves of his son’s actions against Iraq. "Former President Bush does not support the war against Iraq," says former aide John Ruskin. "It is as simple at that." While conservative critics who have not yet seen Fahrenheit 9/11 dismiss the work as an anti-Bush screed, Roger Friedman of the normally pro-Bush Fox News Network has seen the film and calls it "a tribute to patriotism, to the American sense of duty
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Europe’s five worst child killers By Alex Kirby BBC News Online environment correspondent Five killer conditions account for one death in three among young Europeans, the World Health Organization says. In a study published in the UK medical journal The Lancet, the WHO lists them as outdoor and indoor air pollution, unsafe water, lead, and injuries. The organisation describes the report as the first major assessment of the overall impact of the environment on child health across Europe. It will be discussed by ministers from 52 countries in Budapest next week. They will be attending WHO Europe’s conference on environment and health in Budapest, from 23 to 25 June. The ministers are expected to adopt the Children’s Environment and Health Action Plan for Europe (Cehape) after discussing the report. Fuel danger It is entitled Burden Of Disease And Injuries Attributable To Selected Environmental Factors Amongst Europe’s Children And Adolescents. Known as the Environmental Burden Of Disease (EBD) report, it was completed by two Italian institutions, the University of Udine and the Institute for Childhood Burlo Garofalo of Trieste. It says 34% of deaths among Europeans from birth to the age of 19 are attributable to the five factors. The leading cause of death is injuries, mostly unintentional, with road traffic accidents especially prominent in western Europe. "There should be legislation about driving with no alcohol, about slowing the speed in urban areas and planning settlements so that children can play, walk and go to school safely," said lead author Georgio Tamburlini, from the WHO. Fire, drowning and poisoning are frequent causes in other parts of the continent. Across Europe (which the WHO defines as including central Asian countries such as Kyrgyzstan and its neighbours) outdoor pollution kills up to 13,000 children aged under four every year. But indoor air pollution, caused mainly by the use of solid fuel, is estimated to kill more than 50,000 under-fours annually throughout Europe, the report says. It thinks a move by families from solid to less polluting liquid or gaseous fuels could save the lives of more than 9,000 children annually. Child orientation More than two million people in WHO’s European region are thought to lack access to clean water, exposing children to a high risk of diseases linked to diarrhoea. "Access to safe water is the main issue," Dr Tamburlini told the BBC. "In several countries in central and Eastern Europe we still have schools where there is no safe water and up to 20% of households don’t have access." CHILD DEATHS IN EUROPE Indoor air pollution kills 50,000 under-fours every year A move from solid to liquid or gas fuels could save 9,000 children a year Outdoor air pollution kills 13,000 under fours every year The report says lead is "still the single most important chemical toxicant for children" in Europe, causing mild mental retardation in many of them. WHO says the need for child-specific estimates of the burden of disease is critical for making decisions. It says one of the fundamentals of paediatrics – that children are not simply small adults – has not normally been considered in policy-making, the setting of standards, or legislation. Yet children are more vulnerable than adults to several environmental threats. Their organs are developing rapidly, they live and play "closer to the ground", they have a longer time for latent agents to cause damage, and they have less control over their lives than adults. The Health Protection Agency (HPA) agrees that WHO’s initiative is an important one. "There is a need for more research into potential environmental threats to children’s health," said an HPA spokesperson. "The Agency is currently making a substantial contribution to the development of Cehape, which will be launched at the WHO Europe Ministers’ meeting next week in Budapest." http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/science/nature/3816579.stm
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The Republicans are definitely going to try and steal the election. Walt
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It may be a repeat of 1984 instead of 2000. William R. James
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It may be a repeat of 1984 instead of 2000. William R. James
Except in 1984, Reagan won fairly. — "If there is to be blame, it properly rests here in this office and with this president. And I accept responsibility for the bad as well as the good." - Ronald Reagan, accepting responsibility for deaths of 241 marines in Lebanon "I don’t want to sound like I’ve made no mistakes. I’m confident I have. I just haven’t – you just put me under the spot here and maybe I’m not quick – as quick on my feet as I should be in coming up with one." - George W. Bush, shirking all responsibility.
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The Republicans are definitely going to try and steal the election. Walt
And the democrats wont for a change? William R. James
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It may be a repeat of 1984 instead of 2000. William R. James Except in 1984, Reagan won fairly.
Yeah.. so? Bush did the same thing in 2000, although with a much tighter race. William R. James
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It may be a repeat of 1984 instead of 2000. William R. James Except in 1984, Reagan won fairly. Yeah.. so? Bush did the same thing in 2000, although with a much tighter race.
How could have Bush won fairly when not all the votes were counted? — "The true axis of evil in America is the brilliance of our marketing combined with the stupidity of our people." – Bill Maher
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It may be a repeat of 1984 instead of 2000. William R. James Except in 1984, Reagan won fairly. Yeah.. so? Bush did the same thing in 2000, although with a much tighter race.
Uh-huh. — "If there is to be blame, it properly rests here in this office and with this president. And I accept responsibility for the bad as well as the good." - Ronald Reagan, accepting responsibility for deaths of 241 marines in Lebanon "I don’t want to sound like I’ve made no mistakes. I’m confident I have. I just haven’t – you just put me under the spot here and maybe I’m not quick – as quick on my feet as I should be in coming up with one." - George W. Bush, shirking all responsibility.
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– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It may be a repeat of 1984 instead of 2000. William R. James Except in 1984, Reagan won fairly. Yeah.. so? Bush did the same thing in 2000, although with a much tighter race. How could have Bush won fairly when not all the votes were counted?
Who needs to count votes? — "If there is to be blame, it properly rests here in this office and with this president. And I accept responsibility for the bad as well as the good." - Ronald Reagan, accepting responsibility for deaths of 241 marines in Lebanon "I don’t want to sound like I’ve made no mistakes. I’m confident I have. I just haven’t – you just put me under the spot here and maybe I’m not quick – as quick on my feet as I should be in coming up with one." - George W. Bush, shirking all responsibility.
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"I don’t want to sound like I’ve made no mistakes. I’m confident I have. I just haven’t – you just put me under the spot here and maybe I’m not quick – as quick on my feet as I should be in coming up with one." - George W. Bush, shirking all responsibility.
Really not sure how this is shirking all responsibility, please explain. http://ww.warisnottheanswer.net/
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"I don’t want to sound like I’ve made no mistakes. I’m confident I have. I just haven’t – you just put me under the spot here and maybe I’m not quick – as quick on my feet as I should be in coming up with one." - George W. Bush, shirking all responsibility. Really not sure how this is shirking all responsibility, please explain.
Men of good conscience can acknowledge their mistakes and take responsibility for them. Like Reagan did when he took responsibility for the deaths of 241 marines in Beirut. Like Clinton did when he apologized the all of America for indiscreet behavior which lead to the impeachment fiasco. Bush, OTOH, cannot even fathom that he’s made a mistake. It’s always someone else’s fault. Bad intel on WMDs? Not datamining by BushCorp, no. It was Tenet’s fault. The Niger-Uranium story? Again, it was either Tenet’s fault for allowing Bush to lie or it was British intel’s fault for giving Bush faulty intel. Nevermind that Joe Wilson told Bush flat out that it was lie. Not Bush’s fault. Never Bush’s fault. — "If there is to be blame, it properly rests here in this office and with this president. And I accept responsibility for the bad as well as the good." - Ronald Reagan, accepting responsibility for deaths of 241 marines in Lebanon "I don’t want to sound like I’ve made no mistakes. I’m confident I have. I just haven’t – you just put me under the spot here and maybe I’m not quick – as quick on my feet as I should be in coming up with one." - George W. Bush, shirking all responsibility.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It may be a repeat of 1984 instead of 2000. William R. James Except in 1984, Reagan won fairly. Yeah.. so? Bush did the same thing in 2000, although with a much tighter race.
How could have Bush won fairly when not all the votes were counted?
The votes were counted under the laws in effect on election day T.Carr
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It may be a repeat of 1984 instead of 2000. William R. James Except in 1984, Reagan won fairly. Yeah.. so? Bush did the same thing in 2000, although with a much tighter race. How could have Bush won fairly when not all the votes were counted? Who needs to count votes?
Apparently not Al Gore, or the Democrat majority of the Florida Supreme Court. They were going to be content with a 4 county recount to settle the issue. Justice Beyer, dissent Bush vs. Gore (12/12/2000) "….. 3 U.S.C.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – 50 Million Phone Customers Could Face Higher Bills 50 million telephone customers in the U.S. could soon face higher phone bills after the Bush administration announced that it no longer supports a law that requires the four regional Bell companies who control the phone lines to give their rivals access to the lines at discounted prices in order to spur competition. The Supreme Court is currently reviewing whether the four companies, Verizon, SBC Communications, BellSouth and Qwest must allow competing companies to use their phone lines at a subsidized cost since the Bells have a near monopoly on the phone lines. Not everyone in the Bush administration is in agreement of the policy change. President Bush’s chief advisor Karl Rove fears customers who face larger phone bills may be less likely to vote for Bush. A lot of people are having their home phones disconnected and using a cell phone for all their local and long distance calls. The Cable Company needs to also get into the phone business. That’s four or five competitors. That’s what I call competition. Me, I like my tin can and my string. – old and reliable technology. LOL!
I dumped Verizon entirely in favor of voice service thru my ISP (cable co.). All digital service, unlimited calls to the entire US 24/7, flat rate of $34.95 (which is really that – VOiP isn’t taxed yet), etc.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – 50 Million Phone Customers Could Face Higher Bills 50 million telephone customers in the U.S. could soon face higher phone bills after the Bush administration announced that it no longer supports a law that requires the four regional Bell companies who control the phone lines to give their rivals access to the lines at discounted prices in order to spur competition. The Supreme Court is currently reviewing whether the four companies, Verizon, SBC Communications, BellSouth and Qwest must allow competing companies to use their phone lines at a subsidized cost since the Bells have a near monopoly on the phone lines. Not everyone in the Bush administration is in agreement of the policy change. President Bush’s chief advisor Karl Rove fears customers who face larger phone bills may be less likely to vote for Bush.
A lot of people are having their home phones disconnected and using a cell phone for all their local and long distance calls. The Cable Company needs to also get into the phone business. That’s four or five competitors. That’s what I call competition. Me, I like my tin can and my string. – old and reliable technology. LOL!
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50 Million Phone Customers Could Face Higher Bills 50 million telephone customers in the U.S. could soon face higher phone bills after the Bush administration announced that it no longer supports a law that requires the four regional Bell companies who control the phone lines to give their rivals access to the lines at discounted prices in order to spur competition. The Supreme Court is currently reviewing whether the four companies, Verizon, SBC Communications, BellSouth and Qwest must allow competing companies to use their phone lines at a subsidized cost since the Bells have a near monopoly on the phone lines. Not everyone in the Bush administration is in agreement of the policy change. President Bush’s chief advisor Karl Rove fears customers who face larger phone bills may be less likely to vote for Bush. Headlines from http://www.DemocracyNow.org = = = = STILL FEELING LIKE THE MAINSTREAM U.S. CORPORATE MEDIA IS GIVING A FULL HONEST PICTURE OF WHAT’S GOING ON? = = = = Daily online radio show, news reporting: www.DemocracyNow.org = = = = Sorry, we cannot read/reply to most usenet posts but welcome email For more information: http://EconomicDemocracy.org/wtc/ (peace) And http://EconomicDemocracy.org/ (general) ** ANTI-SPAM EMAIL NOTE: For email "info" and "map" don’t work. Email instead ** to m-a-i-l-m-a-i-l (without the dashes) at economicdemocracy.org
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Question:
Why is it OT? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Why is this here, Xenos? < entire posted crud removed
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They put PCP in your water where you live? How does anyone do anything being all stoned out of their tree? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It will be funny soon since the climate is changing. We get warnings in Finland of how much fish we can eat because of the PCP in the water. Once a week is OK. Around Turku the male fish is getting sterile or is turning to females. It affects 80-95% of the male fish in Turku waters. Anti-baby pills are the cause of this. And yes excessive heat killed 10 thousands in Europe last year. I think we are in for the big fun but who will laugh will be the gods and not us. Enjoy the coming fun. whine whine whine ( A copy from some other ng )
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If y’all gotta ask….. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Why is it OT? Why is this here, Xenos? < entire posted crud removed
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PCP is a by product of the plastic production and i was not talking about drinking water but about the see water. Now put your crack pipe away. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – They put PCP in your water where you live? How does anyone do anything being all stoned out of their tree? It will be funny soon since the climate is changing. We get warnings in Finland of how much fish we can eat because of the PCP in the water. Once a week is OK. Around Turku the male fish is getting sterile or is turning to females. It affects 80-95% of the male fish in Turku waters. Anti-baby pills are the cause of this. And yes excessive heat killed 10 thousands in Europe last year. I think we are in for the big fun but who will laugh will be the gods and not us. Enjoy the coming fun. whine whine whine ( A copy from some other ng )
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It will be funny soon since the climate is changing. We get warnings in Finland of how much fish we can eat because of the PCP in the water. Once a week is OK.
I could be wrong with the " PCP ". I have it from the radio but when Fins say B it sounds like P. Anyway it has to do with the production of plastics and that in the end you find it in the see and it is accumulating in fish. It could be that they meant dioxin. That’s why they recommend not to eat more then once a week fatty fish like salmon for instance. Here are some links: http://www.oehha.ca.gov/water/phg/referenced_docs/pcp_c.html http://www.pesticideinfo.org/Detail_ChemReg.jsp?Rec_Id=PC34087 The above 2 are about PCP Further down are about PVC http://www.greenpeaceusa.org/media/factsheets/poisonplastictext.htm http://archive.greenpeace.org/toxics/html/content/pvc1.html http://www.acereport.org/pvc2.html http://houseofstrauss.co.uk/m-wfsection+article+articleid-439.html http://www.becnet.org/ENews/98FaPlastic.html http://shirtmagic.com/PVC.htm And a positive link http://www.google.fi/search?hl=fi&ie=UTF-8&q=environmentally+friendly… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – Around Turku the male fish is getting sterile or is turning to females. It affects 80-95% of the male fish in Turku waters. Anti-baby pills are the cause of this. And yes excessive heat killed 10 thousands in Europe last year. I think we are in for the big fun but who will laugh will be the gods and not us. Enjoy the coming fun. wine wine wine ( A copy from some other ng )
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its in the water where you live too John. Some people have suggested its a cause of declining human male fertility. Xenos … this is all the result of that damn chimpanzee who used a stick to get the termites out of the log. bogey – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – They put PCP in your water where you live? How does anyone do anything being all stoned out of their tree? It will be funny soon since the climate is changing. We get warnings in Finland of how much fish we can eat because of the PCP in the water. Once a week is OK. Around Turku the male fish is getting sterile or is turning to females. It affects 80-95% of the male fish in Turku waters. Anti-baby pills are the cause of this. And yes excessive heat killed 10 thousands in Europe last year. I think we are in for the big fun but who will laugh will be the gods and not us. Enjoy the coming fun. whine whine whine ( A copy from some other ng )
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If it were that simple. I don’t vote because i don’t think anybody could represent me. And voting for the lesser evil is still voting for evil. For me the state is there to serve it’s citizens. No more and no less. I have installed a water purificator to my waterline. I only drink and only cook with filtered water. It has an active carbon filter to. But plastics are a problem. I think its all about awareness. To be aware and to know and to make the best possible decision at any given time. " Only a fool would trade he’s freedom for more security ". I like that one and yes i know some arabs. I let them live according to the ethics of their society and they do the same with me. About the oil prices going up: I think it’s good. It will propel alternative energy up. Denmark gets 20% of it’s electricity thru windmills. WHAT THIS ALL HAS TO DO WITH DIVORCE? I am very tired but i try to answer this: Ethics has very much to do with divorce. I got my morals from my grandparents and my mother. My grandfather was very important to me. My ex-wife had only her parents who’s morals were rotten. It gave me a boost of power when i met my aunt Stassa after 42 years. I met aunt Demetra to. Society is falling apart. The big family which is including grandparents uncles and aunts is falling apart. This makes people weaker and less stable. Less stable people will probably divorce more easily. I want to be a good and responsible grandfather. My grandfather was a whacko but he could teach some important things anyway. I have the whacko gene as well. It’s on today. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – its in the water where you live too John. Some people have suggested its a cause of declining human male fertility. Xenos … this is all the result of that damn chimpanzee who used a stick to get the termites out of the log. bogey They put PCP in your water where you live? How does anyone do anything being all stoned out of their tree? It will be funny soon since the climate is changing. We get warnings in Finland of how much fish we can eat because of the PCP in the water. Once a week is OK. Around Turku the male fish is getting sterile or is turning to females. It affects 80-95% of the male fish in Turku waters. Anti-baby pills are the cause of this. And yes excessive heat killed 10 thousands in Europe last year. I think we are in for the big fun but who will laugh will be the gods and not us. Enjoy the coming fun. whine whine whine ( A copy from some other ng )
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I don’t recall who is, nor the exact quote. Maybe the mistress of the Internet can find the originals?)
B? bogey
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It’s a cause of far more than just that..cancer, thyroid disease…..
– Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – its in the water where you live too John. Some people have suggested its a cause of declining human male fertility. Xenos … this is all the result of that damn chimpanzee who used a stick to get the termites out of the log. bogey They put PCP in your water where you live? How does anyone do anything being all stoned out of their tree? It will be funny soon since the climate is changing. We get warnings in Finland of how much fish we can eat because of the PCP in the water. Once a week is OK. Around Turku the male fish is getting sterile or is turning to females. It affects 80-95% of the male fish in Turku waters. Anti-baby pills are the cause of this. And yes excessive heat killed 10 thousands in Europe last year. I think we are in for the big fun but who will laugh will be the gods and not us. Enjoy the coming fun. whine whine whine ( A copy from some other ng )
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its in the water where you live too John. Some people have suggested its a cause of declining human male fertility.
PCBs are probably in the water near John. PCPs, probably not. It’s a while since I was to date on the fertility deal for human males, but when last I tuned in seriously the conclusion was that the earlier-claimed decline in male fertility was an artefact of not comparing equals, and on looking at an unreliable proxy. After getting back to the variable of interest and making comparisons between equals, there was no apparent change in actual fertility of the men. Xenos … this is all the result of that damn chimpanzee who used a stick to get the termites out of the log.
"Some say it was coming out of the trees that was our mistake. Some say it was climbing on to land. I say it’s been all downhill since we stiffened the notochord." (Quotes to signify that I’m not the original source. Unfortunately I don’t recall who is, nor the exact quote. Maybe the mistress of the Internet can find the originals?) — Robert Grumbine http://www.radix.net/~bobg/ Science faqs and amateur activities notes and links. Sagredo (Galileo Galilei) "You present these recondite matters with too much evidence and ease; this great facility makes them less appreciated than they would be had they been presented in a more abstruse manner." Two New Sciences
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Within the next millenium, global warming will return the earth to its proper owner. Because mankind (so obviously) is incapable of responsibly managing it. So don’t feel so bad. It will be, as it deserves to be.
who is this mankind guy ? Should we email him and tell him do you think? bogey
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WHAT THIS ALL HAS TO DO WITH DIVORCE? I am very tired but i try to answer this: Ethics has very much to do with divorce. I got my morals from my grandparents and my mother. My grandfather was very important to me. My ex-wife had only her parents who’s morals were rotten. It gave me a boost of power when i met my aunt Stassa after 42 years. I met aunt Demetra to. Society is falling apart. The big family which is including grandparents uncles and aunts is falling apart. This makes people weaker and less stable. Less stable people will probably divorce more easily.
Hey Demetre, I’ve already told ya. If you look at the Big Picture, it’s being taken care of, as we speak. Within the next millenium, global warming will return the earth to its proper owner. Because mankind (so obviously) is incapable of responsibly managing it. So don’t feel so bad. It will be, as it deserves to be. We (do indeed) reap what we sow.
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- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – WHAT THIS ALL HAS TO DO WITH DIVORCE? I am very tired but i try to answer this: Ethics has very much to do with divorce. I got my morals from my grandparents and my mother. My grandfather was very important to me. My ex-wife had only her parents who’s morals were rotten. It gave me a boost of power when i met my aunt Stassa after 42 years. I met aunt Demetra to. Society is falling apart. The big family which is including grandparents uncles and aunts is falling apart. This makes people weaker and less stable. Less stable people will probably divorce more easily. Hey Demetre, I’ve already told ya. If you look at the Big Picture, it’s being taken care of, as we speak. Within the next millenium, global warming will return the earth to its proper owner. Because mankind (so obviously) is incapable of responsibly managing it. So don’t feel so bad. It will be, as it deserves to be. We (do indeed) reap what we sow.
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If it were that simple. I don’t vote because i don’t think anybody could represent me. And voting for the lesser evil is still voting for evil. For me the state is there to serve it’s citizens. No more and no less.
If it were that simple. The questions in my mind are "what is the state?", "how does it arise", "are there ways to describe its behaviour". Perhaps the word "organisation" should be substituted for "state". I put some thoughts here but deleted them because they are very OT. I think its all about awareness.
i agree. My grandfather was very important to me. My ex-wife had only her parents who’s morals were rotten. It gave me a boost of power when i met my aunt Stassa after 42 years. I met aunt Demetra to. Society is falling apart. The big family which is including grandparents uncles and aunts is falling apart.
One must ask what society is. This makes people weaker and less stable. Less stable people will probably divorce more easily. I want to be a good and responsible grandfather. My grandfather was a whacko but he could teach some important things anyway. I have the whacko gene as well. It’s on today.
good Xenos. whacko genes are fun. bogey
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whine whine whine – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – ( A copy from some other ng ) THIS IS NO WAY TO LIVE by Jan Lundberg Living by the clock. Eating by the clock. Clocking your speed down the deathway road. Surrounded by walls. Buying things you need that you could have and should have made or grown. Not having money to buy the things you need and not having land that can provide them. Being told what to do and think by authorities who serve the rich. Being subject to innumerable laws designed to control a rising population. Getting cancer from chemical exposures deliberately allowed into the air, water and food. Paying pharmaceutical companies for questionable cures when the drugs are just more fossil fuel derivatives like the chemicals that gave you cancer. Watching a hard-working society bleed to death from wars and karmic costs of killing millions of innocents abroad over the decades. Being isolated so much that material things serve as friends. This is no way to live. The list can go on forever, such is the moral bankruptcy of our "leaders" and the failure of an educational system that requires mainly conformism. This is not a "This is how to live." But think on these things: Growing more food locally, for everyone. Taking care of the land, air, and water as if they are ours and our ancestors’ and descendents’. Deciding for ourselves what is right, when it comes to action on any issue. Making decisions via consensus and not marginalizing or excluding a segment of the population. Spending our money in our own economy instead of sending wealth to corporations in Detroit or "Delaware." Having time to spend with your family, friends, and doing what you want to do. Educating your own children. Having your parents and grandparents around to help teach. Painting or writing your masterpiece. Singing your song, sharing your poem. Healing the land as you heal your body. Loving all whom you chose, if welcome, and restricting no one from freedoms such as loving. Taking responsibility for your own life – making your destiny – by living your adventure. Learning whatever you can and applying it. making your destiny – by living your adventure. Learning whatever you can and applying it. When there is no TV and no petroleum, the above changes can and will be carried out and not just thought upon. The entire socioeconomic system is a fraud if it serves up cancer on a bun: Billions and billions of units "served," manufactured, broken, land-filled It’s too little too late for recycling as a solution to maintain our present habits. Best get outraged and walk out of the fast food "restaurant" before allowing one more of your hard earned dollars to be misappropriated. May love and peace come to you. –Jan Lundberg
http://www.bluegreenearth.us/archive/article/2004/culture-change/lund… – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – "WE ARE AT WAR WITH THE EARTH ITSELF" Please read the top of that page. If you think Jan’s newsletter is exaggerating, read this from BBC: "Most of us think that something unpleasant may soon happen but we are as confused over what to do about it as we were in 1938. "We are at war with the Earth itself. We are Gaia’s target now" -Professor James Lovelock Excerpts from BBC Story: One of the UK’s best-known scientists, Professor James Lovelock, says only a catastrophe will prompt the world to tackle the threat of climate change. He says the global climate treaty, the Kyoto Protocol, is simply an attempt to appease a self-regulating Earth system. Professor Lovelock thinks the Earth’s attempts to restore its equilibrium may eliminate civilisation and most humans. He wants a rapid end to the destruction of natural habitats, which he says are key to planetary climate and chemistry. Professor Lovelock won acclaim for developing the Gaia Hypothesis, which suggests the Earth functions as a single organism which maintains the conditions necessary for its survival. …Professor Lovelock said: "In the late 1930s when I was a student we knew that war was imminent, but there was no clear idea of what to do about it. Future fears "I find a marked similarity between attitudes over 60 years ago and those now towards the threat of global [climate] change. "Most of us think that something unpleasant may soon happen but we are as confused over what to do about it as we were in 1938. "Our response so far is just like that in 1938, an attempt to appease. The Kyoto agreement is uncannily like that of Munich, with politicians out to show that they do respond but in reality are bidding for time." Professor Lovelock said global warming was "the response of our outraged planet", and the consequences for humanity were likely to be far worse than any war. "We are at war with the Earth itself", he said. "We are Gaia’s target now." Professor Lovelock added that we had still to wake up to the seriousness of our plight, with some people continuing to deny that global change even existed. Heeding them, or the deep Greens who rejected science, would allow the planet to return to its normal state of health, "but by eliminating the majority of humans and probably civilization as well". …Scorched Earth policy "Our goal should be the cessation of fossil fuel consumption as quickly as possible, and there must be no more natural habitat destruction anywhere. "To attempt to farm the whole Earth to feed people, even with organic farming, would make us like sailors who burnt the timbers and rigging of their ship to keep warm. "The natural ecosystems of the Earth are not just there for us to take as farmland; they are there to sustain the climate and the chemistry of the planet." In place of sustainable development, Professor Lovelock called for "a well-planned sustainable retreat", a programme that would dwarf the space and military programmes. He said his hope lay "in that powerful force that takes over our lives when we sense that our tribe or nation is threatened from outside". Professor Lovelock told BBC News Online: "I do think it will take a disaster to wake us up. "We had one in Europe last summer with the heatwaves which killed 20,000 people. I’m afraid it will take more of the same, or something else like that, to stir us." http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/3766831.stm How to act? Some ideas… 1) Sites for action: http://www.greenhousenet.org/ 2) and http://www.gristmagazine.com/dogood/climate.asp 3) Support http://www.solarcatalyst.com/ 4) Support alt energy, a) http://www.nativeenergy.com/ b) www.earthsolar.com c) http://www.realgoods.com/renew/index.cfm 5) "Do it yourself" at http://www.pathtofreedom.com/diy/index.shtml 6) Join/support local groups — cooperative supermarkets, community supported agriculture (CSAs) (search for one at http://www.sare.org/csa/) local farmer’s markets, local currencies (see http://www.ithacahours.com/starterkit.html) small locally owned business like health food stores, self-help initiatives like holistic care and projects like the Ithaca Health Fund http://www.ithacahealth.org/ or even start an alternative to wall street (http://www.ithacanews.org/wise.html ) start small, start local, grow shoots, and expand from there.. 7) Support Post Carbon Institute’s call for a "Global Relocalization" movement by supporting http://www.PostCarbon.org and help organize a screening of the movie The End of Suburbia on global relocalization, http://www.postcarbon.org/takeaction/eos/ = = = = STILL FEELING LIKE THE MAINSTREAM U.S. CORPORATE MEDIA IS GIVING A FULL HONEST PICTURE OF WHAT’S GOING ON? = = = = Daily online radio show, news reporting: www.DemocracyNow.org = = = = Sorry, we cannot read/reply to most usenet posts but welcome email For more information: http://EconomicDemocracy.org/wtc/ (peace) And http://EconomicDemocracy.org/ (general) ** ANTI-SPAM EMAIL NOTE: For email "info" and "map" don’t work. Email instead ** to m-a-i-l-m-a-i-l (without the dashes) at economicdemocracy.org
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rest assured the Earth will be returned to its proper owner,
You mean Oprah?
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Why is this here, Xenos? – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text -< entire posted crud removed
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Don’t worry too much about it, Dimetre. Within the next mileniuum, you can rest assured the Earth will be returned to its proper owner, as a direct result of what mankind has done. So see, it all works out in the end. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – It will be funny soon since the climate is changing. We get warnings in Finland of how much fish we can eat because of the PCP in the water. Once a week is OK. Around Turku the male fish is getting sterile or is turning to females. It affects 80-95% of the male fish in Turku waters. Anti-baby pills are the cause of this. And yes excessive heat killed 10 thousands in Europe last year. I think we are in for the big fun but who will laugh will be the gods and not us. Enjoy the coming fun. whine whine whine ( A copy from some other ng )
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It will be funny soon since the climate is changing. We get warnings in Finland of how much fish we can eat because of the PCP in the water. Once a week is OK. Around Turku the male fish is getting sterile or is turning to females. It affects 80-95% of the male fish in Turku waters. Anti-baby pills are the cause of this. And yes excessive heat killed 10 thousands in Europe last year. I think we are in for the big fun but who will laugh will be the gods and not us. Enjoy the coming fun. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – whine whine whine ( A copy from some other ng )
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( A copy from some other ng ) THIS IS NO WAY TO LIVE by Jan Lundberg Living by the clock. Eating by the clock. Clocking your speed down the deathway road. Surrounded by walls. Buying things you need that you could have and should have made or grown. Not having money to buy the things you need and not having land that can provide them. Being told what to do and think by authorities who serve the rich. Being subject to innumerable laws designed to control a rising population. Getting cancer from chemical exposures deliberately allowed into the air, water and food. Paying pharmaceutical companies for questionable cures when the drugs are just more fossil fuel derivatives like the chemicals that gave you cancer. Watching a hard-working society bleed to death from wars and karmic costs of killing millions of innocents abroad over the decades. Being isolated so much that material things serve as friends. This is no way to live. The list can go on forever, such is the moral bankruptcy of our "leaders" and the failure of an educational system that requires mainly conformism. This is not a "This is how to live." But think on these things: Growing more food locally, for everyone. Taking care of the land, air, and water as if they are ours and our ancestors’ and descendents’. Deciding for ourselves what is right, when it comes to action on any issue. Making decisions via consensus and not marginalizing or excluding a segment of the population. Spending our money in our own economy instead of sending wealth to corporations in Detroit or "Delaware." Having time to spend with your family, friends, and doing what you want to do. Educating your own children. Having your parents and grandparents around to help teach. Painting or writing your masterpiece. Singing your song, sharing your poem. Healing the land as you heal your body. Loving all whom you chose, if welcome, and restricting no one from freedoms such as loving. Taking responsibility for your own life – making your destiny – by living your adventure. Learning whatever you can and applying it. making your destiny – by living your adventure. Learning whatever you can and applying it. When there is no TV and no petroleum, the above changes can and will be carried out and not just thought upon. The entire socioeconomic system is a fraud if it serves up cancer on a bun: Billions and billions of units "served," manufactured, broken, land-filled It’s too little too late for recycling as a solution to maintain our present habits. Best get outraged and walk out of the fast food "restaurant" before allowing one more of your hard earned dollars to be misappropriated. May love and peace come to you. –Jan Lundberg http://www.bluegreenearth.us/archive/article/2004/culture-change/lund… "WE ARE AT WAR WITH THE EARTH ITSELF" Please read the top of that page. If you think Jan’s newsletter is exaggerating, read this from BBC: "Most of us think that something unpleasant may soon happen but we are as confused over what to do about it as we were in 1938. "We are at war with the Earth itself. We are Gaia’s target now" -Professor James Lovelock Excerpts from BBC Story: One of the UK’s best-known scientists, Professor James Lovelock, says only a catastrophe will prompt the world to tackle the threat of climate change. He says the global climate treaty, the Kyoto Protocol, is simply an attempt to appease a self-regulating Earth system. Professor Lovelock thinks the Earth’s attempts to restore its equilibrium may eliminate civilisation and most humans. He wants a rapid end to the destruction of natural habitats, which he says are key to planetary climate and chemistry. Professor Lovelock won acclaim for developing the Gaia Hypothesis, which suggests the Earth functions as a single organism which maintains the conditions necessary for its survival. …Professor Lovelock said: "In the late 1930s when I was a student we knew that war was imminent, but there was no clear idea of what to do about it. Future fears "I find a marked similarity between attitudes over 60 years ago and those now towards the threat of global [climate] change. "Most of us think that something unpleasant may soon happen but we are as confused over what to do about it as we were in 1938. "Our response so far is just like that in 1938, an attempt to appease. The Kyoto agreement is uncannily like that of Munich, with politicians out to show that they do respond but in reality are bidding for time." Professor Lovelock said global warming was "the response of our outraged planet", and the consequences for humanity were likely to be far worse than any war. "We are at war with the Earth itself", he said. "We are Gaia’s target now." Professor Lovelock added that we had still to wake up to the seriousness of our plight, with some people continuing to deny that global change even existed. Heeding them, or the deep Greens who rejected science, would allow the planet to return to its normal state of health, "but by eliminating the majority of humans and probably civilization as well". …Scorched Earth policy "Our goal should be the cessation of fossil fuel consumption as quickly as possible, and there must be no more natural habitat destruction anywhere. "To attempt to farm the whole Earth to feed people, even with organic farming, would make us like sailors who burnt the timbers and rigging of their ship to keep warm. "The natural ecosystems of the Earth are not just there for us to take as farmland; they are there to sustain the climate and the chemistry of the planet." In place of sustainable development, Professor Lovelock called for "a well-planned sustainable retreat", a programme that would dwarf the space and military programmes. He said his hope lay "in that powerful force that takes over our lives when we sense that our tribe or nation is threatened from outside". Professor Lovelock told BBC News Online: "I do think it will take a disaster to wake us up. "We had one in Europe last summer with the heatwaves which killed 20,000 people. I’m afraid it will take more of the same, or something else like that, to stir us." http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/3766831.stm How to act? Some ideas… 1) Sites for action: http://www.greenhousenet.org/ 2) and http://www.gristmagazine.com/dogood/climate.asp 3) Support http://www.solarcatalyst.com/ 4) Support alt energy, a) http://www.nativeenergy.com/ b) www.earthsolar.com c) http://www.realgoods.com/renew/index.cfm 5) "Do it yourself" at http://www.pathtofreedom.com/diy/index.shtml 6) Join/support local groups — cooperative supermarkets, community supported agriculture (CSAs) (search for one at http://www.sare.org/csa/) local farmer’s markets, local currencies (see http://www.ithacahours.com/starterkit.html) small locally owned business like health food stores, self-help initiatives like holistic care and projects like the Ithaca Health Fund http://www.ithacahealth.org/ or even start an alternative to wall street (http://www.ithacanews.org/wise.html ) start small, start local, grow shoots, and expand from there.. 7) Support Post Carbon Institute’s call for a "Global Relocalization" movement by supporting http://www.PostCarbon.org and help organize a screening of the movie The End of Suburbia on global relocalization, http://www.postcarbon.org/takeaction/eos/ = = = = STILL FEELING LIKE THE MAINSTREAM U.S. CORPORATE MEDIA IS GIVING A FULL HONEST PICTURE OF WHAT’S GOING ON? = = = = Daily online radio show, news reporting: www.DemocracyNow.org = = = = Sorry, we cannot read/reply to most usenet posts but welcome email For more information: http://EconomicDemocracy.org/wtc/ (peace) And http://EconomicDemocracy.org/ (general) ** ANTI-SPAM EMAIL NOTE: For email "info" and "map" don’t work. Email instead ** to m-a-i-l-m-a-i-l (without the dashes) at economicdemocracy.org
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The carbon dioxide measurements have been taken from the 11,400ft summit of Hawaii’s Mauna Loa, whose enormous dome makes it the most substantial mountain on earth, by scientists working for the US government’s National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration.
An active VOLCANO that emits, among other things, CO2. http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/volc_images/north_america/hawaii/… oa.html Monitoring volcanic gases can be helpful in predicting eruptions. For example, an increase in CO2 and SO2 concentrations emitted from fumaroles may indicate increasing magmatic activity beneath the volcano. http://volcano.und.nodak.edu/vwdocs/volc_images/north_america/hawaii/… oa.html Thanks for the warning, Chicken Little.
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Published on Sunday, March 28, 2004 by the lndependent/UK Global Warming Spirals Upwards by Geoffrey Lean Levels of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere have jumped abruptly, raising fears that global warming may be accelerating out of control. Measurements by US government scientists show that concentrations of the gas, the main cause of the climate exchange, rose by a record amount over the past 12 months. It is the third successive year in which they have increased sharply, marking an unprecedented triennial surge. Scientists are at a loss to explain why the rapid rise has taken place, but fear that it could show the first signs that global warming is feeding on itself, with rising temperatures causing increases in carbon dioxide, which then go on to drive the thermometer even higher. That would be a deeply alarming development, suggesting that this self-reinforcing heating could spiral upwards beyond the reach of any attempts to combat it. The development comes as official figures show that Britain’s emissions of the gas soared by three per cent last year, twice as fast as the year before. The increase – caused by rising energy use and by burning less gas and more coal in power stations – jeopardizes the Government’s target of reducing emissions by 19 per cent by 2010. It also coincides with a new bid to break the log jam over the Kyoto treaty headed by Stephen Byers, the former transport secretary, who remains close to Tony Blair. Mr Byers is co-chairing with US Republican Senator Olympia Snowe a new taskforce, run by the Institute of Public Policy Research and US and Australian think tanks, which is charged with devising proposals that could resolve the stalemate caused by President Bush’s hostility to the treaty. The carbon dioxide measurements have been taken from the 11,400ft summit of Hawaii’s Mauna Loa, whose enormous dome makes it the most substantial mountain on earth, by scientists working for the US government’s National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration. They have been taking the readings from the peak – effectively breathalyzing the planet – for the past 46 years. It is an ideal site for the exercise, 2,000 miles from the nearest land and protected by freak climatic conditions from pollution from Hawaii, more than two miles below. The latest measurements, taken a week ago, showed that carbon dioxide had reached about 379 parts per million (ppm), up from about 376ppm the year before, from 373ppm in 2002 and about 371ppm in 2001. These represent three of the four biggest increases on record (the other was in 1998), creating an unprecedented sequence. They add up to a 64 per cent rise over the average rate of growth over the past decade, of 1.8ppm a year. The US scientists have yet to analyze the figures and stress that they could be just a remarkable blip. Professor Ralph Keeling – whose father Charles Keeling first set up the measurements from Mauna Loa – said: "We are moving into a warmer world".
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Humans, not Sun Responsible for Global Warming Scientists have dethroned the Sun as the dominant source of climate change, leaving the finger of blame pointing at humans At the European Geophysical Society Millennium conference, meeting in Nice, France, the Sun has been dethroned as the dominant source of climate change, leaving the finger of blame pointing at humans. A correlation between the sunspot cycle and temperatures in the northern hemisphere seemed to account for most of the warming seen up until 1985. But new results reveal that for the past 15 years something other than the Sun – probably greenhouse emissions – has pushed temperatures higher. In 1991, Knud Lassen of the Danish Meteorological Institute in Copenhagen and his colleague Eigil Friis-Christensen found a strong correlation between the length of the solar cycle and temperature changes throughout the northern hemisphere from 1861 to 1989. The mysterious – and unexplained – relationship appeared to account for nearly 80 per cent of the measured temperature changes over this period. Now Lassen and astrophysicist Peter Thejll have updated the research and found that while the solar cycle still accounts for about half the temperature rise since 1900, it fails to explain a rise of 0
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