Activism Change

Maintain miltary standards

Question:

 Maintaining Military Standards By John F. McManus Kelly Flinn is now a civilian. the celebrated graduate of the Air Force Academy and the first female ever to fly a B-52 bomber accepted a general discharge rather than face a court martial over charges of adultery and fraternizing with an enlisted soldier. The honorable discharge she had initially sought was denied her and, without it, she  won’t be able to continue flying for the Air Force Reserve. Feminists would have us believe that th e only charge against Flinn was that she committed adultery. But this 26 year old trail blazing female jet pilot was about to be disciplined by the Air Force for disobeying a formal order that she break off her adulterous relationship with another woman’s husband, for having another affair with an enlisted man, and for lying about her escapades when questioned by her superiors. Kelly Flinn had been told so often that she was special that she apparently felt Air Force’s rules didn’t apply to her. She was a national symbol. She had been on 60 minutes and was the subject of plenty of other media attention. Where did the Air Force get the right to interfere with her off duty life? Wasn’t she being singled out because she was female? Never mind that during  the previous year the Air Force had prosecuted 67 others, 60 of them men. Never mind that the military is special and that it has to have unique rules such as barring fraternization between officers and enlisted personnel. Never mind that the wife of the man she invited into her bed is the real victim here. Air Force Chief of Staff General Ronald Fogelman put Flinn’s case into proper perspective when, during testimony before Senate Appropriations Committee, he declared, "This is an issue about an officer entrusted to fly nuclear weapons who disobeyed an order, who lied. That’s what this is all about." According to the military’s code, lying is punishable by five years in prison,Adultery can earn another year. Disobeying a formal order piles up more time behind bars. What did Kelly Flinn offer as an excuse for her admitted transgressions? "I was only 25 years old at the time and … very confused," she whined on 60 minutes. Confused about rules of conduct for officers? Wasn’t she an Air Force Academy graduate whose four years of training is built around strict obedience to rules? Should anyone confused about relatively minor policies be given the awesome responsibilities of piloting a nuclear armed plane? Flinn was considered so special she once piloted a B-52 carrying secretary of the Air Force Sheila Widnall. When her indiscretions could no longer be tolerated and the date was set for her court martial, she figured that the Air Force,rather than she,was in a terrible bind. so she offered a deal: She would resign rather than have the Air Force get a lot of bad publicity over the treatment she was receiving a long as it was an honorable discharge so he could  continue to fly in the Air Force Reserve. Air Force officials confirmed that there is no precedent for someone to resign and receive an honorable discharge after the date of a court martial has been set. Nevertheless, the day before the trail was supposed to begin, Flinn formally sent her request for special treatment. The case landed before Air Force Secretary Windall. A graduate of Massachusetts Institute of Technology, She became that school’s first alumna to head the engineering faculty.  In 1979, when she was named the chairwoman of the entire faculty, she described herself as "a radical feminist." It must have been painful for Windnall to conclude that the Air Force’s first female bomber pilot could no longer serve. After postponing the date for the court martial, Widnall ruled on May 22nd that an honorable discharge was "unacceptable." Was Flinn treated unfairly because she was a woman? The secretary maintained, "No I absolutely reject that." As is so often the case, the larger issue is being ignored: Women don’t belong in combat situations.  If Flinn thinks she was singled out because of her gender, just imagine how she could have been singled out because as a POW in the Hanoi Hilton.The North Vietnamese brutalized our male pilots; just think what they might have  done to a female. No worthwhile nation should ever put its women in such danger. Military service isn’t a right, but a privilege. The battlefield is no place for social experimentation. The need in the services is for the physically strongest and the most psychologically able to kill. Flying an airplane in peacetime may be exciting, but war is hell and women don’t belong in the middle of it. Kelly Flinn, who deserved much worse, got her general discharge and a requirement that she pay the Air Force $18,000 for failing to fulfill her five year obligation. But even if her record had been completely pure, her precedent setting career shouldn’t be viewed as a victory. Whether she knows it or not, she was used by those who are determined to weaken our military.  Now the nation will likely see her used even more by sexual revolutionaries. Watch for television appearances, speaking engagements, books, and movies. Our guess is that we haven’t heard the last of Kelly Flinn.

Response:

- Hide quoted text — Show quoted text –  Maintaining Military Standards By John F. McManus Kelly Flinn is now a civilian. the celebrated graduate of the Air Force Academy and the first female ever to fly a B-52 bomber accepted a general discharge rather than face a court martial over charges of adultery and fraternizing with an enlisted soldier. The honorable discharge she had initially sought was denied her and, without it, she  won’t be able to continue flying for the Air Force Reserve. Feminists would have us believe that th e only charge against Flinn was that she committed adultery. But this 26 year old trail blazing female jet pilot was about to be disciplined by the Air Force for disobeying a formal order that she break off her adulterous relationship with another woman’s husband, for having another affair with an enlisted man, and for lying about her escapades when questioned by her superiors. Kelly Flinn had been told so often that she was special that she apparently felt Air Force’s rules didn’t apply to her. She was a national symbol. She had been on 60 minutes and was the subject of plenty of other media attention. Where did the Air Force get the right to interfere with her off duty life? Wasn’t she being singled out because she was female? Never mind that during  the previous year the Air Force had prosecuted 67 others, 60 of them men. Never mind that the military is special and that it has to have unique rules such as barring fraternization between officers and enlisted personnel. Never mind that the wife of the man she invited into her bed is the real victim here.

Who is the "real victim" when the US military routinely set up a brothels in an area that they operate? The words "double standard" were invented for the US military’s duplicity and hypocrisy in these "adultery" cases. The net effect has been to make the military look about as foolish as it possibly can… -SJ

Response:

Who is the "real victim" when the US military routinely set up a brothels in an area that they operate?

<sound f/x: screeching brakes Excuse me?  The US Military?  When and where.  In my studies of miltary history, the US Army has had one of the worst cases of overblown morality in history.   — |  http://www.hooked.net/~dberry/index.html  | |    "History is the vast and tangled web    | |     of Conspiracy."              -Anon.    |

Response:

The military enforces laws mandated by congress.  In general, however, they attempt to ignore adultery.  However, when a criminal act is brought to a commander’s attention, the first thing the commander must do is investigate. The fact that an enlisted soldier accused an officer of violating the law can not be ignored.  The commander, if I read the case correctly, investigated. First he was lied to (enough to end the career of any officer).  Then, when it became obvious that he was lied to, he ordered the lieutenant to stop.  She disobeyed the order. Now, the commander could ignore an officer who lies and disobeys and order. However, it is unlikely.  Once he decided court martial was his choice, he HAD to charge Flynn with adultery, as that is the only way that the prosecuter can talk about the "what" in the lie and the disobedience.  Since it is technically illegal, you can’t talk about it in a court case unless it is charged.  The sequence would go:  Prosecutor asks the commander "What was the lie?"  The commander would answerr "That she wasn’t having an affair with the husband of this enlisted person." The objection from the defense attorney would be "criminal behavior not charged" and the judge would sustain the objection and the case is lost. The "double standard" is that the average commander would rather NOT do this at all.  Unfortunately, they are placed in the position where they don’t have many choices when the behavior is formally brought to their attention. By the way, do you have documentation which shows the military setting up brothels?  Especially would like to see documentation of the "routine" part of your post, as I wouldn’t be surprised to find it has happened some time in the last two hundred years. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – <snipped Who is the "real victim" when the US military routinely set up a brothels in an area that they operate? The words "double standard" were invented for the US military’s duplicity and hypocrisy in these "adultery" cases. The net effect has been to make the military look about as foolish as it possibly can… -SJ

Response:

Who is the "real victim" when the US military routinely set up a brothels in an area that they operate?

Where? For that matter, what does it have to do with anything? The words "double standard" were invented for the US military’s duplicity and hypocrisy in these "adultery" cases.

And the words "lying under oath" and "conduct unbecomming a commissioned officer" and lets not forget "contracry to the good order and discipline of a military organization", while not invented by Lt Flynn, were exemplified at their worst. The net effect has been to make the military look about as foolish as it possibly can…

Bull, Flynn got caught, Flynn got busted, people whined. Later…             Tim

Response:

Maintaining Military Standards By John F. McManus

<snip the Kelly Flinn story up to here, I agreed.  Lt. Flynn disobeyed a direct order, then expected special treatment.  Good ridance. As is so often the case, the larger issue is being ignored: Women don’t belong in combat situations.  If Flinn thinks she was singled out because of her gender, just imagine how she could have been singled out because as a POW in the Hanoi Hilton.The North Vietnamese brutalized our male pilots; just think what they might have  done to a female. No worthwhile nation should ever put its women in such danger.

Really?  I suppose you’ve never heard of the Night Witches, Russia’s female combat pilots who flew biplanes as couriers and attack pilots. Their speciality was cutting engines and gliding into German formations, cutting loose with machine guns with no warning. Also from Russia, numerous partisans were women, as were many member of the French Marquis.  One of the war’s deadliest snipers was a Russian woman who survived Stalingrad. Israel has used women as pilots and tank crewmembers. Military service isn’t a right, but a privilege. The battlefield is no place for social experimentation. The need in the services is for the physically strongest and the most psychologically able to kill. Flying an airplane in peacetime may be exciting, but war is hell and women don’t belong in the middle of it.

The same arguement was used to keep Jews and blacks out of the army. Ever see a woman defend her young?  I’ll show you able to kill.  In the past few years, we’ve seen that women are fully capable of doing jobs it was thought were too "manly".. police, fire,etc.. Kelly Flinn, who deserved much worse, got her general discharge and a requirement that she pay the Air Force $18,000 for failing to fulfill her five year obligation. But even if her record had been completely pure, her precedent setting career shouldn’t be viewed as a victory. Whether she knows it or not, she was used by those who are determined to weaken our military.  Now the nation will likely see her used even more by sexual revolutionaries. Watch for television appearances, speaking engagements, books, and movies. Our guess is that we haven’t heard the last of Kelly Flinn.

For every Kelly Flinn, there are twenty Col. Cannmeyers (sp?), brave women who serve with pride and honor, and exceed the standards set for them.  Women who understand what duty, honor, country means.  You seek to make an example of Lt. Flinn.  What of the 160 other female combat pilots in the Navy and Air Force? — |  http://www.hooked.net/~dberry/index.html  | |    "History is the vast and tangled web    | |     of Conspiracy."              -Anon.    |

Response:

says… Kelly Flinn, who deserved much worse,

I hope she writes a book and really gives her side of the story.  As far as I’m concerned, the military looked really bad in this whole thing, and your opinion on the matter is out of touch with reality.

Response:

Filed under: Feminist

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